DB Multiverse

The Big Gete Star was saying:

How did Polar die? Mentioned in Novel?

Bojack killed him, after the entire 'remaining' Crew used teamwork to gang up on Polar. See Page 2298.
So ironic, the best display of teamwork in DB(-fanfiction), of all people, it's this Hera-Jin Space-Pirate Crew.

[img]

2 Replie(s)

DB Multiverse page 2650

iron leaf 2 days, 11h

The city's skyline looks incredible. Great work by the artist. It definitely has a different architectural style than the cities on Frieza's planet in DBZ—similar, yet distinct. I wonder what else served as inspiration besides DB itself. Coruscant from Star Wars comes to mind.

DB Multiverse page 2650

iron leaf 2 days, 11h

Panel 1 ist sowas von Perfekt. Die Lichteffekte in den Farben sind unglaublich. Man weiß manchmal garnicht wie sehr solch ein Effekt den Eindruck auf eine Szene beeinflusen kann. Bardock's Augen wirken gelblich, anstatt grünlich, aber das ist wegen den Lichteffekten, welches druch Coldyu's Attacke generiert wird. Großes Lob an das Colors-Team.

DBMultiverse Colors page 514

iron leaf 2 days, 12h

Bardock im letzten Panel. Das ist eines der Fälle, wo die Qualität von Asura noch nicht ausgreift war. Ich möchte nicht haten, lediglich mich daran erinnern wie sehr sich Asura seitdem weiterentwickelt hat. Freue mich sehr, wie so ein Ausnahmekünstler hier bei DBM so eine unglaublichen Verbesserung erlebt hat, die man miterleen kann. Von Seite zu Seite. Die Faren unterstreichen die Qualitätsunterschiede nochmals.

DBMultiverse Colors page 513

iron leaf 2 days, 12h

Das hier war lange Zeit eines meiner Lieblings Turnierkämpfe in DBM. Es ist eine wirkliche Freude es endlich in Frabe zu sehen. Danke an das Team.

DBMultiverse Colors page 512

iron leaf 2 days, 12h

Irgendwie wirken die Panels "unscharf". Ich weiß nicht, ob es an der Skalierung der Originalseite liegt, oder die Koloristen einen bestimmten Effekt herbeirufen wollten.

DBMultiverse Colors page 511

iron leaf 2 days, 12h

Es sieht schon ziemlich cool aus. Das kann man nicht leugnen. Trotzdem frage ich mich, warum Goku nicht den SSJ2 eingesetzt hat. Diese Form hätte definitiv ausgereicht, um Bardocks Aufprall abzufedern. 1 Replie(s)

DBMultiverse Colors page 515

iron leaf 2 days, 12h

Xehanorto was saying:

This might be when we see the Kaios seal Bojack away, since from their perspective the organized villainy of the Frost Demons is much more tolerable compared to the rampant destruction and chaos that the Space Pirates could bring.

I have to agree with that. The in-universe reason why the Frost Demons, of all beings, were tolerated by the Kaios (and Kaioshins) in the past might possibly be that Freeza and his race were actually interested in governing. In a sense, they maintain functioning interstellar civilizations that engage in trade and are rule-abiding, etc. Even though Freeza’s family, for example, is organized like a dictatorship and occasionally destroys a planet, the overarching ecosystem of the universe functions this way. Bojack, on the other hand, isn’t interested in ruling. He destroys everything in his path like a plague of locusts.

Very nice cover art. I wonder who the woman(?) below Bojack is; there were six surviving members of the last special, and she isn't any of them; it was the five that we recognized, plus some long-haired dude. Maybe Cold's dad has some backup jackylls in storage.

We mustn’t forget that in the U16 Special, Chapter 77, we see a trio of Jaykals, also known as Hera-Jins. According to their statements on pages 1777 through 1779, they were administered a serum that was either improved or similar to the one given to Bojack. Later on in the special, we also see civilians who look very much like ordinary Jaykals, or Hera-Jins.

This means the race is definitely not extinct in DBM continuity. Only their home planet was devastated by the Frost Demons. We can safely assume that Bojack’s crew are not among the last remaining members of their species. Unlike the Saiyans.

As for the character in the bottom left corner of the cover, I have no idea. It seems to be a new original character, which I welcome. And the sixth member of the remaining Bojack crew from the last special will likely be the final casualty of the Bojack crew before they’re sealed away by the Kaios.

SSGSSJ4VEGITO was saying:

Im actually excited about this one, womder if it will be just Snower who fights or if it will be Cold and Snower fighting Bojack and his gang. Also I wonder if this will be where the Kais seal Bojack away maybe mid battle or something in weakened state or just by surprise

I’d be against Cold being there in person if Snower dies or loses to Bojack. Because King Cold in DBZ always seems to brag about how invincible he and Frieza supposedly are. The very idea that another species could actually be stronger than Frostdemons would never even cross their minds. At least, that’s how Cold comes across in DBZ. If he personally witnessed his stronger father losing to people of a different race, I’d argue he wouldn’t behave the way we’re used to seeing him. 1 Replie(s)

iron leaf 2 days, 12h

Axadro was saying:

Ich finds immer wieder witzig das ein Detail anscheinend nie vorkommt wenn es um die Frostdämonen geht, wobei es sein kann das es nur in der deutschen Version vorkommt aber ich glaube nicht.
Beim anflug von Freezer und Cold auf die Erde sagte Freezer das Cold Ihm helfen würde selbst wenn dieser keine Lust darauf hätte weil sonst seine Oma, also Colds Mutter, eine ordentliche Tracht prügel verteilen würde. Das ist zwar die einzige Stelle wo jemals ein weibliches Mitglied der Spezies beschrieben wird aber dennoch finde ich es witzig das es wohl von allen übersehen wird, einschließlich Toriyama und den Teams die offizielles Zeug erstellen.

Ich muss zugeben, das wusste ich nicht. Entweder hatte ich es schon vor langer Zeit vergessen, oder es ist mir nie aufgefallen. Auch wenn es zu Toriyamas Humor passen würde, ziehe ich DBMs Idee vor, dass sich Frostdämonen asexuell fortpflanzen.

Slav was saying:

Ich danke dir, für für die Übersicht. Seit Hanasias Fanfic, liegen schon ein paar Jahre zurück und ich hatte noch in Erinnerung das der hier, eine Rebellion gegen den Patriarch Blizzard, als abtrünniger Sohn geführt hat. 😄Bis zur Entstehung der Piraterie von Bojack war er noch an der Macht, oder zumindest seine eigenen beiden Söhne. Dieses Kapitel wird sehr wahrscheinlich verdeutlichen, warum am Ende nur noch Cold, mit seinem eigenen Nachwuchs später verblieb und wie die Kaios eingreifen mussten.

Das ist wahrlich sehr faszinierend. Ich mag die DBM Lore bezüglich Frostdämonen und Hera-Jins aka Jaykals. Wer hätte es gedacht, ausgerechnet diese beiden Spezies zusammenzubringen.

iron leaf 12 March

Reminder for the course of the chapter. Any crashing out regarding the fact that there is a Bojack chapter at all will not be tolerated. Please do not ask for other specials from other universes in the comments.

Here is a small graphic that illustrates Freeza's family tree in the DBM-Continuity. It was created using information from previous specials and the content of the “Hanasia, Queen of the Saiyans” novel.

[img]

A quick refresher on what we know from previous specials and what this cover on this page suggests.

After the empire of Snower and his sons Cold and Polar attacked Planet Jayna, the Jaykals (aka Hera-Jin) secretly worked on a project to become stronger than the Frost Demons themselves. It worked, but Bojack turned renegade, killed the (apparently) military leader, made a name for himself as a space pirate, and killed Polar in battle. 1 Replie(s)

CellJuniorJunior was saying:

iron leaf 12 March

Hoffentlich erfahren wir wie Cold zum neuen Herrscher wird. Dazu muss etwas mit Snower passieren und ich bin mir ziemlich sicher, dieses Kapitel wird es endlich aufklären. Vielleicht erfahren wir auch wie die 4 Kaios die restliche Bojack Bande versiegelt.

Frage mich immernoch wie von allen interessanten Movie Bösewichten Bojack von Salagir ausgewählt wurde der hat praktisch gar kein charackter

Der Hauptgrund hierfür scheint darin zu liegen, Bojack's Film passt perfekt in die Kontinuität von DBZ (und damit auch in die von DBM), ohne dass irgendetwas geändert werden muss.

Slav was saying:

Müsste der kleine gehörnte aufm Thron, nicht basierend auf Hanasias Fancic, Freezers Opa sein!? 😁

Das ist absolut richtig. Falls jemand an den Details von Freezer's Stammbaum in der DBM-Kontinuität interessiert ist, könnte diese Tabelle hilfreich sein.

[img]

1 Replie(s)

iron leaf 11 March

The question is, will this chapter shed light on the demise of Cold's father or the sealing of Bojack's gang by the Kaios? Maybe even both. I'm very excited. The art style is definitely very interesting.

iron leaf 9 March

The fact that Cyborgs/Robots cannot be detected via Ki sensing is played out perfectly in favor of the villains in this scenario.

Finally, C17 can shine. Of all the Legacy characters in DBM so far, I think he had the most unglamorous portrayal. 2 Replie(s)

DB Multiverse page 2648

iron leaf 8 March

We absolutely need Pan's reaction in panel 3 as an emoji for the Discord server. 😂

DB Multiverse page 2647

iron leaf 8 March

@Regarding the Q&A from Salagir and Dark Senzu. The topic is being prolonged unnecessarily and is not part of today's page. It is drifting too far off-topic. I kindly ask that you not continue this topic any further.

@U18 Vegeta
Regarding Vegeta's defeat.
I understand the frustration. People expected an entire chapter dedicated to the confrontation between the two Vegetas. But the allegation that our Vegeta was treated unfairly, just to make him look ridiculous, is more than unjustified.

No legacy character in DBM has had a better run in terms of portrayal than Vegeta. If you disregard OCs, U18 Vegeta has only had scenes that portray him positively or, at worst, neutrally since the beginning of DBM. All of his tournament fights have shown him to be mature, dominant, and resourceful. He brought up the Saiyans' misguided ways in the fight against his alter ego from U10. He fought an honorable battle against his son from the future, even though he could have taken him out from the start. He left behind his years-long obsession with Goku in his past by half-heartedly defeating Kakarot. And he didn't even give Cell the honor of presenting his new form. Even in his tournament defeat against Goku, Vegeta was satisfied and even lost with a smile on his face. The match could have gone either way in the final stages, as both were at the same level.

Even outside of the tournament, we see the incredible soft power of U18 Vegeta. He is the one who motivates Pan to fight Kakarot. He trusts Pan to save her mother from Majin spectators so that she can gain experience herself. He was the one who held Bra in his arms when Hatchiya screamed, to at least give her a little comfort. Vegeta was one of the few who actually mastered the Majin Punisher. In the Colors version, he is one of those who rushes to Pan's rescue against Kakarot. Even in the novel, it was U18 Vegeta who was one of the first to notice that U11 Babidi was up to something and wanted to confront the wizard, which forced Babidi to put forward his plan/the MR arc. And much, much more.

I don't want to dictate whether people should like this chapter or not. But I just want to take a stand that U18 Vegeta has been presented in an incredibly flattering way throughout the entire comic so far. And that one bad “L” is not the same as Salagir treating Vegeta the way DBZ treated Vegeta.

iron leaf was saying: However, the scene moved so quickly that by the time they had a chance to ask a Namekian, Babidi had already intervened. And then Zenbuu. (Page 69)

Actually, in the Q&A session of the very next page 70, it stated:
“Would the organizers have healed Uub (as they are supposed to, but that's a big wound)?
Hu... good question. They don't have senzu, but the Vargas may have good surgeons. I'd say the Vargas would have sewed the arm back (over a long time in ER) then an organizer Namekian would have healed him.”

So for Namekian to heal a broken arm, you need surgeons to stitch your arm back first then the healing can work.
Touché
I don’t think anyone here can stitch Vegeta’s broken arm back, especially the arm kind broken into pieces in page 2638

Touché

iron leaf 8 March

Fluxx was saying:

hey danke. soviel war mir, dank der Kommentare klar. aber was die technik genau macht ist nicht wirklich bekannt oder?
kommentare hab ich alle gelesen. danke

Der Anwender schießt mit beiden Händen einen Blitzstrahl auf das Ziel und fängt den Gegner in einem elektrischen Feld ein. Laut Yamcha in der englischen Synchronisation wandelt diese Technik die gesamte Energie im Körper des Anwenders in 20.000 Volt Elektrizität um.

Der Angriff ist extrem tödlich und gefährlich, weshalb Roshi ihn lieber nicht einsetzt. Normalerweise kann der Gegner nicht entkommen, doch Goku gelang die Flucht, indem er sich beim Anblick des Vollmonds in einen Oozaru verwandelte.

Es gibt viele Spekulationen darüber, dass Roshi lediglich mit der Todbringenden Wirkung des Angriffs geblufft hat, um Goku einzuschüchtern und ihn zur Aufgabe zu zwingen.

In diesem Zusammenhang ist auch erwähnenswert, wie Son Bra den Angriff gleichzeitig gegen drei Gegner einsetzt. Und wir können deutlich sehen, wie alle drei gleichermaßen von dem Angriff betroffen sind. Es gibt auch Spekulationen, dass Bankoku Bikkuri Shō nicht mit der Kraft des Anwenders (Son Bra) zusammenhängt, sondern mit der des Opfers (Nappa, Kakarot, Vegeta). Mit anderen Worten: Nappa empfindet eine andere Intensität des Schmerzes als Vegeta. Der Grund für diese Spekulation ist, zu erklären, warum ein Saiyajin in seiner Base Form und ein SSJ3 Saiyajin durch denselben Angriff gleichermaßen außer Gefecht gesetzt wurden. (Letztendlich kann dies als Comic-Relief abgetan werden.)

ArabSuperSaiyan was saying:

iron leaf 6 March

Roos was saying:

Or find his counterpart in their universe lol. He'll have no idea why they are so insistent on befriending him haha.

After DBM is over, back in U18 on New Namek:

Pan:
“OMG, Luska, there you are. You're the best, how many times have you helped us out of a jam. I just had to meet you again and thank you for your help. Even though you're a different version, you're still the same person. Hopefully we can be friends.”

Luska:
“Who are you? How do you know my name? What's going on here?”

😂

Roos was saying:

Just theory crafting here, but I'm guessing the plan is to have him freed at some point and there'll be a rematch. I do think Vegeta 18 wouldn't kill him though, just humiliate him proper, and then Raditz will actually get the kill on him and Nappa.

If they actually take the U13 Saiyan trio back to their base camp, something like that could happen. It would be quite interesting if XXI's people could operate behind enemy lines and weren't automatically taken out of action until the end of the arc.

kyra was saying:

They forgot about 18.. Piccolo can't sense her ki she is free to report back to xxi

Once again I’m reminding people that this mess wasn’t cleaned up as Android 18 escaped.

She can now tell XXI that the good guys didn’t get trapped.

I'm glad that U14 finally has something to do. Their advantage of not being detected by KI sensing makes them invaluable allies to XXI in this particular scenario.

iron leaf 6 March

So the Namekian can heal broken arm? Then why Uub ask for other’s help at the beginning of the tournament?
I thought only senzu or Buu or Gast can regenerate your broken body pieces.

Pan did mention that Uub should ask a Namekian. However, the scene moved so quickly that by the time they had a chance to ask a Namekian, Babidi had already intervened. And then Zenbuu. (Page 69) 1 Replie(s)

iron leaf 6 March

Son Bra uses the good old Galactic Donut™. So extra effort is being made to ensure that the trio survives. Interrogation incoming.

Luska is proving to be a helpful team member. The Z-Fighters should take him with them to U18 when everything is over. Haha. 1 Replie(s)

iron leaf 4 March

Diese Seite unterstreicht die rohe Brutalität eines solchen Faustkampfs. Die Effekte sehen phänomenal aus. Cold wird im Moment als echte Bedrohung für Bardock dargsetellt. Wirklich sehr mitreißend.

DBMultiverse Colors page 510

iron leaf 4 March

Damals behauptete Roshi, dass er Goku mit diesem Angriff töten könne, und nutzte dies als Erpressungsmittel, um Goku zur Aufgabe zu zwingen. Allerdings wurde Roshis Angriff unterbrochen, als Goku sich in einen Oozaru verwandelte. Nun frage ich mich, wie viel Wahrheit in Roshis Aussage steckte.

Denn in diesem Szenario wendet Son Bra diese Technik gleichzeitig bei drei Personen an, die sich in ihrer Kampfkraft enorm unterscheiden. Woher wissen wir, dass Nappa überleben wird? Oder ist die Wirkung unabhängig von der Kampfkraft? Ein sehr interessantes Thema. 1 Replie(s)

iron leaf 4 March

Ouroboros was saying:

Honestly why does the Power level Hammer know so many techniques ?

Even though Vegetto and Son Bra have a complicated relationship, she receives continuous training. Vegetto (at least from his point of view) teaches her everything she might need for her future. See Page 303.

So Vegeto decided to learn that (from Roshi? Despite being depicted as an arrogant prick who looks down on techniques?) and then teach it to her? It's moving the issue somewhere else, now we have to think Vegeto the BIGGER NUMBERRRRR TECHNIQUES DON'T MATTER guy is picking up moves from 12 year old Goku's fights (and then also teaching it to his daughter on top of that) instead of Goku himself?
Goku is the martial artist with an eternal wall to scale here, I think these moves are thematically way more appropriate in his bag than these guys who are pretty disconnected from these martial arts roots..

You obviously did not remember or did not read the U16 Novel.

OldDBFan was saying:

Didn't expect this, thought I guess Bra and Piccolo would like to question them. But I have a question of my own: Where have gone their black flames?

Well spotted. That's right, the black XXI smoke isn't visible. I guess it's because, at the very moment the attack hits them all, it was omitted for the sake of better visual clarity. We'll probably see it on the next page. Or maybe the attack somehow negates the smoke. It's hard to say.

That's a matter that was discussed in the previous pages and thus less relevant for today's one, but I'll answer nonetheless: the writers decided 1. Vegeta needed saving and 2. Goku was unavailable but Bra wasn't.
Change any of these and you can have solutions that maintain the sacred internal logic while keeping the chapter and payoff focused on characters that are actually relevant to the matters at hand.

So, when a writer develops a scenario, they establish certain things for the setting. Places, characters, motivation, etc.

In the MR-Arc, Babidi teleported away all the good tournament participants (with exceptions). A setting was developed where a certain group of people fight, while other characters were left out. So, theoretically, one could ask on every page, why did Babidi do it that way? Yes, because the author wanted it that way. And the story followed the setting that was introduced at the beginning of the MR arc. There's no point in complaining about it on every page.

At the beginning of the chapter, we saw most of the characters are in the U16/U18 base camp. If you wanted to exclude Son Bra from participating in the rescue mission, you could have made sure to not show her at the beginning, which could have hinted that she was experiencing a different adventure similar like Vegeta and Pan. But that wasn't done. She was shown, making her available as a potential character for later scenes. Son Bra's presence on page 2622, is quite frankly a chekhov's gun for her being used here now.

You complain about why the story wasn't written completely differently from the beginning (of the chapter). Let me portray it with an example outside Dragonball. You don't take Resident Evil 4, and complain that Umbrella is no longer part of the game. "Argh, the game developers decided that Leon would now fight Spanish cults, but if they had rewritten something at the beginning, we could have seen Umbrella as the enemy again." Well, duh. 3 Replie(s)

iron leaf 4 March

At least use Goku if you had to bring back a (literal) blast from the past, he's the one who was there and experienced it firsthand, from his master.

But ... Son Bra did learn it from someone with firsthand experience with that technique. And she calls him father. 2 Replie(s)

iron leaf 4 March

That's the strangest Light Grenade I've ever seen. 😂

But seriously. It's really nice that old techniques are being revisited (except Dodonpa, it seems, aggressive panting), which apparently a lot of people, I mean a whole lot of people, didn't have on their radar.

So, unless Nappa happens to see a moon and transforms into an Oozaru, he should actually die. Unless Son Bra regulates the strength of the attack so much that it doesn't kill anyone. Hmm, Roshi was definitely in the same general power level tier as Goku. Here, the power levels vary enormously. 3 Replie(s)

iron leaf 4 March

Nach all den Jahren erinnert sich U16 Piccolo weiterhin sehr gut, wie Vegeta so war, bevor Vegetto geboren wurde.

Damian Qualshy was saying:

iron leaf 4 March

Just to clarify, I believe this scenario with Son Bra and Piccolo as the rescue team makes sense. Nevertheless, I would have personally preferred it if there had been at least three of them, with Gohan joining the team. Three people in Piccolo's safety bubble would still be acceptable in terms of maneuverability (worse than with only two people, but not as difficult as in the last chapter where all the survivors U16/U18 Z-Fighters were in a safety bubble together). Meanwhile, at base camp, we have a second Son Gohan, then the alarmed Son Goten & Trunks are ready for the fusion, plus Son Goku, who would probably have paused his search for injured civilians to be ready for battle. During the rescue mission, Son Bra could have performed the teleportation rescue, while Son Gohan could have hit U13 Vegeta with full force. That would have been my alternative.

Utility was saying:

Every other time, no matter how much the odds were against her, she won. Her only real loss was to Gohan as a little kid who she's been shown to be able to beat 2 of them now.

I won't dispute your analysis. I just wanted to briefly note that hyperbole can be very concerning for a healthy culture of discourse. Statements that go to such extremes and are often repeated without context can create a false narrative among readers.
Piccolo is not the smartest strategist who can always analyze things flawlessly. Gohan is not the absolute pacifist who despises fighting with every fiber of his being. Goku is not the mentally disabled idiot who knows nothing but fighting. I just don't want Son Bra to be mistakenly pigeonholed, even if it's only to correct the fact that she does indeed lose fights.

Utility was saying:

I can somewhat agree with you about the chapter titles don't always have to be what the full chapter is about, but that one in particular you mentioned was just called "XXI" and it showed his first fight and the repercussions of it so I wouldn't say that one is misleading.

Regarding misleading chapter titles. I wouldn't say that chapter 112 paints a false picture. The question arises as to which Vegeta is better, and from the moment we accompany Vegeta with Pan and Luska, U18 Vegeta appears in 14 pages, and U13 Vegeta also appears in 14 pages so far. Son Bra, on the other hand, has only appeared in 3 pages so far. I don't dispute that she steals the limelight. However, you can't say that the majority of the chapter isn't about the conflict between the two Vegetas. While we're on the subject of whether a chapter could have any connection to the theme of its title.

What do you mean "Perhaps"? >:(
Next you're gonna say it's Kiko-ho.

I allowed myself a little joke, as the hand poses for initiating two fighting techniques look identical. Jackie Chun's Thunder Shock Surprise and Piccolo Light Grenade are both initiated in the same way. Hence the ambiguous comment that it could be either one or the other.

Andres was saying:

I think I have an idea....

Is it like an OG technique? As in original DB technique? As in 1980s technique... by a really, really old dude? :D

Quite possible. It could indeed be a technique that did not kill the user despite its (usual) lethal effect, perhaps because the victim was a Saiyan, which inevitably led to the summoning of a giant monkey, which in turn led to the destruction of the moon. But who knows, it could be anything, maybe the Kikoho. 🤭 1 Replie(s)

iron leaf 3 March

gourry was saying:

Light grenade?

Zefarg was saying:

Looked familiar instantly, had to think about what it is tho. Looks like Light Grenade, wish the OG brought it back, since it was used only once vs Cell if I am not mistaken

papupata was saying:

She's clearly charging up a solar flare

supersaiyan2kakarot was saying:

The technique Piccolo used against imperfect Cell. Don’t know its English name. Light Grenade?

Angelo was saying:

havent commented in years but bra using light grenade is toughhhh

RealNate was saying:

She was trained by Gohan. Although, a Masako-Ha would have made more sense.

Is Son Bra using light grenade?

Captain Carbonite was saying:

This is for sure the light grenade.

Damian Qualshy was saying:

Uh oh, Bra is pulling a Light Grenade! Finally some Piccolo techniques!

brolyhater was saying:

Light Grenade seems fitting!

ssjlucario was saying:

Weird to pull the Light Grenade out of nowhere, funnier she's using the technique of the guy she's standing right next to

ssjlucario was saying:

Weird to pull the Light Grenade out of nowhere, funnier she's using the technique of the guy she's standing right next to

Arctika was saying:

To everyone, it has been used recently in the novel, so, more reason for you to read it !

That was indeed an interesting scene in ... cough Chapter 169 ... cough. Or maybe it was 168, or maybe 170. Who knows?

Sergio was saying:

Bankoku Bikkuri Shō ?

瘦布欧 was saying:

It's truly nostalgic—to think that was 30 or 40 years ago!

vegy was saying:

What are you guys even going on about? This whole battle is nothing but thematic (besides being a tutorial for battles in timestopland). It might not be "too shounen" but there's absolutely no point in the 2 vegetas battling each other, we already know who's the winner there. Therefore they took a different approach, "our" Vegy getting first burdened by protecting his "family" and actually sacrificing his victory to protect them, and then saved by his "family", with the classic trope which makes the "altruist vegeta" be the real winner. And of course Bra, her "daughter", is thematically relevant in such a scenario.

I would've liked a little bit more Vegy vs Vegy action with the constraints, but this is way better than just a boring battle with an obvious winner, and of course if someone has to save him it's Bra...

I agree with you. There was no reason to have a regular 1-on-1 fight between the two Vegetas, since we already knew that U18 Vegeta was the better fighter. They deliberately gave ours an enormous handicap to create suspense in an otherwise obvious situation. The fact that DBM preferred to let Vegeta save Pan rather than allow him to win with the handicap is, in my opinion, evidence of a greater portrayal and development of our royal sourpuss.

Dicax was saying:

So, did the bad guys use telepathy to know to call it "the Frozen" or is that what the bad guys were already calling it and the good guys just lucked into the same name? I mean, they could have landed on "the Freeze", "The Cold Zone", or any other near variant- convenient. U13 could have simply said "If you free him, he'll die of blood loss!" to avoid this.

It does seem like an incredible coincidence that both Goku on page 2624 and U13 Vegeta refer to the state of IKL's technique as “frozen”. Haha, someone basically made their job easier by having both parties independently come up with the same name.

basemynick was saying:

Here's the thing, why wouldn't they send Bra? It makes the most sense: they had reason to think Vegeta's group was in danger, which means it was a threat 18 vegeta couldn't handle alone. Goku could've gone, but that would take longer than Bra blasting ahead with Piccolo like Vegeta did with the other namekian, and Bra was more confident she could take on whatever threat was putting Vegeta etc in danger. It was likely a very quick decision on her end.

So how would it make any sense for Goku to stop Bra and say "hang on, I'm slower and weaker than you, and roughly as strong as vegeta, let me go instead!"

Haha, yes, in a way. The longer you think about it, the less sense it makes to take Son Bra out of the picture. DBM already has established lore (at least you would expect that after over 2000 pages), which some people always want to ignore for some reason. Furthermore, at the beginning of the chapter, we already saw how Son Bra is one of the people who does nothing specific at base camp. Goten and Trunks practice the new Metamoran Fusion with each other. Goku was shown rescuing civilians from the Frozen. Going the extra mile to explicitly dissuade someone who is currently doing something, as opposed to someone who is completely free, makes little sense.

Frartan117 was saying:

Leeeets see Bra: Oh she kills a great part of his family and Friends with a smile from ear to ear and what she gets: "oooh pooor baby, you were possesed, bad Vegetto, of course everybody forgives you, Ghast even save you and mocks Vegitto, ahh ss2? Sure you can control It after killing everybody, why not? :)"

Um, yes, the Majin Power Boost remains. Unlike the Majin Resilience, which disappears with the spell. Some may not see it that way in DBZ and Vegeta's SSJ2. But in DBM, it's part of the continuity. For example, after the MR arc, U8 Freeza can now control the 5th Form on his own, which he couldn't use before.

Frartan117 was saying:

Something tells me she is not going to pay for these smug faces anytime soon, probably she wont even die a single time in the story, i wonder why. In fact, she didnt lose a single fight in the story.

That's not true. Son Bra lost battles in DBM.

DissapointedReader was saying:

mulled_piss was saying: I have to ask again, what is the thematic relevance of Bra's appearance in this chapterWhy even make the chapter cover about U13 and U18 Vegeta for that matter? Potentially grueling tactical battle showcasing U18 Vegeta's character growth sacrificed so the boring OC character can once again show us how STWONG she is. I don't know what I was expecting. This is an extremely unsatisfying resolution. It's like building up to the Naruto vs Sasuke rematch only for Naruto to slip on a banana peel before the fight can commence just so Sasuke can be one-shotted by some uber strong OC shinobi out of nowhere that has never even had a single conversation with Sasuke, but OMG is he so STWONG!!! Sure, its not satisfying, but it makes sense that the uber strong OC shinobi would show up instead of just relying on Naruto!

I think some people put too much emphasis on chapter titles. Do you remember chapter 33? It was supposed to herald a revelation about XXI. In the end, XXI hardly appears in the chapter at all. 3 Replie(s)

iron leaf 2 March

The last panel makes you feel nostalgic. I wonder who will be the first to recognize the technique, or whether anyone will recognize what it is at all. 8 Replie(s)

iron leaf 2 March

Axadro was saying:

Hoerrinho sagte: Was macht eigentlich vegeto aktuell, weiß man das? Ich weiß es nicht mehr:DDas ist bisher nicht gezeigt worden. Zuletzt haben wir Vegetto gesehen als er XXIs Wunsch unterbrochen hat und dessen Magen zerschmettert hat, wodurch eine immense Explosion entstanden war und dieses I.K.L. Feld gestartet ist. Es kann gut sein das er komplett zertrümmert wurde dabei aber das ist nur eine Vermutung. Wissen tun wir garnichts.

Aber mal eben wegen dem Teleportieren Thema:
Ich hab mir ein paar gedanken gemacht wegen der Teleportation und mir ist da eine Frage aufgekommen: Kann man mit einer der beiden Teleport-Versionen sich versehentlich in ein Objekt porten und damit immensen Schaden sich selbst zufügen?
Ich würde spontan sagen das die Yadrat-Version ein Nein als Antwort hat. Die wurde einfach so häufig verwendet und jedes mal ist Goku nur irgendwo in der Nähe oder direkt neben dem Ziel rausgekommen ohne in einem Objekt zu landen das ich geneigt bin zu sagen das es eine solchen Failsave mit eingebaut hat in die Technik.
Für die Kaioshin-Version aber fällt das nicht so einfach aus. Diese benötigt ja Koordinaten für den Teleport. Der kann durch eine KI-Signatur geliefert werden aber ist nicht nötig. Wir haben aber auch Informationen erhalten während der Majin-Saga darüber wie Kaioshins funktionieren. Zum einen wurde stark angedeutet das Kaioshins eine Möglichkeit haben mehr zu sehen als mit bloßem Auge, aber das scheint ähnlich wie das runterblicken von Gottes Plattform zu funktionieren im Sinne das es nicht überall einfach so nutzbar ist. Darüber hinaus ist der erfahrenere Kaioshin mit 2 Methoden gekommen um überall wo er will zu spionieren. Zuerst meinte er das er sowieso mit seinem göttlichen Auge überall hinschauen könnte wo er will und er hat die Kristallkugel was das selbe kann nur andere können mitschauen. Da er mit einer Hexe fusioniert ist und die Uranei Baba als anderes Beispiel eine solche Kugel nutzt für ihre Wahrsagerei würde ich die Kugel beim alten Kaioshin als Teil der Hexe beschreiben. Aber das göttliche Auge klingte mehr nach Kaioshin. Und auch wenn es Teil eines Gags war glaube ich nicht das er da gelogen hatte.
Das würde bedeuten das Kaioshins mit diesem göttlichen Auge einfach Ihr Ziel vorher ausspähen können bevor sie Teleportieren und damit auch sofort die Koordinaten hätten.
Jetzt aber der wichtige Teil: Vegetto und Bra haben dieses göttliche Auge nicht. Das heißt es besteht die Möglichkeit das dies ein unbekannter Nachteil ist der bisher einfach nur nicht entdeckt wurde. Die Kaioshins haben den wegen ihrem Auge nicht und Vegetto/Bra haben sich bisher nur zu bekannten Orten oder zu KI-Signaturen teleportiert.
Das einzige was da ein Problem sein könnte wäre das Vegetto kurz vor Hyper-Boos ausraster sich weg teleportiert hatte zu einem Asteroiden und es sieht mir nicht so aus als wäre der dort gewesen wo Broly war bevor er zurück geschickt worden war. Es könnte aber auch damit erklärt werden das beim Kampf gegen Broly das der Punkt war wo Vegetto hingeschleudert worden war.

Wenn man das also mit bedenkt dann könnte es sein das Bra aus Sicherheits gründen nicht teleportiert ist aber jetzt wo die Ziele klar im Blick sind kann sie es nutzen. Natürlich nicht zu Vegeta weil die Einschränkung das ein Namekianer-Feld am Zielpunkt sein muss besteht ja noch aber was Bra problemlos machen könnte wäre sich in die Barriere vom anderen Namekianer zu teleportieren. Diese war groß genug damit Vegeta, Pan und der Namekianer reinpasst. Jetzt wo Vegeta fehlt ist auf jeden Fall genug platz für Bra um sich direkt vor den beiden zu porten. Und wenn sie schnell genug ist könnte sie Piccolo vorher greifen und mitnehmen. Aber selbst wenn nicht, sie wäre näher an Vegeta dran und könnte von dort aus einen Blast loslassen.
Und für Piccolo ist ja nur Vegeta unüberwindbar. Kakarott dürfte schwächer sein als Piccolo und Nappa ist ja keine Gefahr.

Interessantes Thema. Der U16-Novel spricht genau das Thema quasi an. Das kann man in Kapitel 7 lesen. Ich verlinke mal ausnahmsweise die Seite. -> U16-Novel-CH7
Kurz gesagt, man kan die Kai Kai nicht nutzen, um versehentlich in Objekten zu landen. Soweit würde es garnicht kommen, da der Anwender die Teleportation in solchen Fällen garnicht vollenden würde.

DB Multiverse page 2642

iron leaf 2 March

@IT vs Kai Kai Discussion
I agree that Son Bra doesn't need IT at this moment, but could just as easily use Kai Kai. However, why does Son Bra specifically mention that she can sense the KI of the others?

My guess:
To explain retrospectively why Son Bra and Piccolo flew and landed at this location instead of teleporting. So that the reader knows that U16, from the distance they came from, couldn't sense anyone's KI until they literally landed.

It's not meant to directly explain why she's now using it to save Pan and Luska, but to indirectly explain why they couldn't do it before.

Bombero was saying:

That's basically what I thought would happen based on the last page. Although it's sort of weird that Bra needs to do the finger thing to teleport. I thought the idea was that Bra and Vegerot had mastered a level two version of this technique which doesn't need Ki sensing or the finger thing.

The two fingers on the forehead were always just an indicator of intense focus, not a real prerequisite for IT itself. When this technique was introduced, Goku teleported to Kame House without his fingers on his forehead to snatch Roshi's sunglasses. Over time, the fingers on the forehead probably just became established as a visual clarity to avoid ambiguity.

Roos was saying:

Majunia was saying: Kaio K was saying: If Bra finishes off U13 Vegeta and the gang instead of U18 Vegeta then this chapter will be truly underwhelming to say the least

No, because it would prove the point that our Vegeta managed to have a family and friends who support him, while the other one is all alone.
This message rings a bit hollow due to the fact he's being saved from people that aren't from his universe(logically assuming this is u16 Piccolo), and feel no connection toward him.

Then this is the perfect opportunity to create a (more profound) connection between U16 and U18. DBM is often criticized for its lack of interaction between the universes (for example, there is still no comic scene featuring Freeza and Cell together).

Roos was saying: Majunia was saying: Kaio K was saying: If Bra finishes off U13 Vegeta and the gang instead of U18 Vegeta then this chapter will be truly underwhelming to say the least

No, because it would prove the point that our Vegeta managed to have a family and friends who support him, while the other one is all alone.
This message rings a bit hollow due to the fact he's being saved from people that aren't from his universe(logically assuming this is u16 Piccolo), and feel no connection toward him.
Exactly this. I'm actually rooting for U13 Vegeta here and I'm not sure that was the intent.

DissapointedReader was saying:

Bradthesaiyan was saying: Kururun was saying: Wow, Bra saves the day. Color me surprised
Would you rather she didn't?
Yes, very much so. Give me literally anyone else please. Any other outcome. I was rooting for U18 Vegeta/Pan/The Namekian as this team of underdogs facing unfavorable odds and having to pull through, now I'm rooting for U13 Vegeta and his buddies. They're the underdogs facing the author's pet now.

I understand that DB characters often don't act smart, but the idea that fans actually want them to keep acting dumb is something new.

What had the making to be a really cool tactical battle has yet again been reduced to 'OC Character Saves the Day Again!' I don't know what I was expecting, but oh well.

Too bad Bra was taking a little nap on page 2306 or page 2520, otherwise she would have stopped everything before it all went down the drain. 😉 1 Replie(s)

DB Multiverse page 2643

iron leaf 27 February

As shown on page 2623, we see Goku is busy rescuing civilians in the frozen.
Probably nobody trusts a multiversal Gotenks to achieve the new Fusion at first try AND handle the situation.
And both Gohans probably agreed that they trust Son Bra to solve the situation.
Afterall, the more people inside Piccolo's bubble, the more difficult it is to move around.

kcheeb was saying:

wait why cant piccolo increase his bubble...

Either because ...
(01) His bubble is large, but he can't extend it to where Vegeta is because it's a bit far.

Or ...
(02) Piccolo can't extend the bubble to Vegeta because Vegeta would start bleeding and could die.

Damian Qualshy was saying:

Of all the people that could show up this is the least satisfying option of the bunch for me. Why would you bring Bra of all people to bail out Vegeta here? Goku has an actual connection to Vegeta and the Saiyans.

Hell, why does Vegeta need bailing out? Especially this fast. If he had to sacrifice himself to protect his comrades and later be saved by them, I wish they'd make it a little more grandiose and spectacular than "gets punched twice, goodbye"

Because Son Bra is de facto the strongest fighter in the U16/U18 base camp right now. Logically speaking this makes the most sense. Additionally, they probably used Kai Kai to teleport to Pan's Ki explosion and from there the found them by sight and landed here. Nobody else could arrive as quickly as Son Bra. 3 Replie(s)

DB Multiverse page 2642

iron leaf 27 February

Congratulations to < thatruth >
One of the few who guessed correctly.

DB Multiverse page 2642

iron leaf 27 February

CRONKdaddy was saying:

iron leaf was saying: Piccolo to the rescue.

It's a bit of a shame that Nappa still hasn't reached SSJ1 after the Majin Boost and the XXI Boost. From a pure power level perspective, I think he should be ready by now. It seems like all that's missing is the emotional trigger.

u think piccolo would show up by himself?

No, of course not. I only mentioned Piccolo because he naturally has to be present. That doesn't mean he's alone, though. Logically, it would make the most sense to send the strongest person on the team and a Namekian who can use the anti-life-skip safety bubble.

This is how I see the events so far:

...
Videl sees the Ki explosion. She tells Person A and Person B about it. U13 Vegeta starts telling Pan and Luska to slowly separate. Person A and Person B teleport (via Kai Kai) to the explosion from Pan's Ki attack. Nappa and Kakarot join U13 Vegeta and they chat briefly. After a quick look, Person A and Person B spot the entire group around U13 Vegeta & Pan and fly towards them at full speed, making a hard three-point landing. Vegeta has an incensed look because he knows he can't win against the person who just arrived.
...

Of course, we can throw out some fantastic speculations, and some sound quite appealing. Mine would be U9 Yamcha, who for some reason returned to U0 off-screen, with a power-up. He's a cyborg, so he doesn't need extra protection from the life skip. But that's all speculation. In contrast, there's our actual knowledge. We know that U16 and U18 set up a camp with U0 survivors, and we know that U16 Videl saw the explosion from Pan's Ki attack. I automatically assume that whoever ended up here must be at least U16 or U18 Piccolo.

DB Multiverse page 2641

iron leaf 26 February

I don't think Captain Garana realizes how precarious his situation is. Even if he were to miraculously win, the question remains how he intends to leave the planet alone.

DB RED page 58

iron leaf 26 February

"Die stoppen nie."
Haha, der ist gut. 😆

Super Dragon Bros Z page 228

iron leaf 26 February

Immer wieder erstaunlich zu sehen, wie einfache Figuren im Dragonball Kosmos tatsächlich von den Kaios Bescheid wissen. Naja, so klingt das zumindest in der Aussage von dieser Figur hier.

Vergleichbar, als würden Erdlinge in Dragonball immer wieder Dende's Name ausrufen, bei jeglicher Gelegenheit. Da würde man sich unweigerlich fragen, woher sie das wissen. Das tun sie ja sonst nicht, außer die Z-Fighters. 1 Replie(s)

Vegeta Tales page 85

iron leaf 26 February

Cooler's use of IT at this moment is on the same level of asspull as when he suddenly used it in the Meta-Coola movie. Both without any foreshadowing in earlier scenes.

I don't mind though. There are a gazillion examples in DB, how someone, somehow reveals out of nowhere something new. It's kinda part of Dragonball's DNA.

Vegeta Tales page 83

iron leaf 26 February

Das Spiel mit der Perspektive ist wirklich sehr cool gemacht auf dieser Seite. Allgemein bin ich ein großer Fan von diesem Kampf.

DBMultiverse Colors page 506

iron leaf 26 February

Sehr schönes Landschaftsbild. Es ist einfach gehalten, ohne viel Spektakel. 👌

Early dayz page 63

iron leaf 26 February

Wow, die Maske hält aber viel aus, beinahe so strapazierfähig wie die Stahltür von Dr. Gero's Labor. 😁 1 Replie(s)

Yamoshi Story page 170

iron leaf 25 February

Piccolo to the rescue.

It's a bit of a shame that Nappa still hasn't reached SSJ1 after the Majin Boost and the XXI Boost. From a pure power level perspective, I think he should be ready by now. It seems like all that's missing is the emotional trigger. 1 Replie(s)

DB Multiverse page 2641

iron leaf 25 February

KingGarland was saying:

iron leaf was saying:
BladedShard was saying: So the Ik'l time stop doesn't affect stray ki blasts even after they've left from an unfrozen zone (the Namekian)? Interesting. That is correct. Energy beams are not affected by Life-Skip at all. For reference, see page 2310, page 2316 and page 2325.

It is true that the Life-Skip doesn't effect ki blasts as seen here. However the examples you referenced I don't think would count as evidence as, with the possible exception of I'k'l, they were all made by androids who don't have ki and don't use it.

That's a fair point you make there. It's entirely possible that the attacks of the androids have different properties than regular AI attacks, and therefore behave differently in Life-Skip. That is to say, android beams could travel in Life-Skip, while others could not.
Nevertheless, I would argue that energy attacks of any kind all behave the same in Life Skip.

Which is certainly weird, because WHY doesn't it affect it? It affects everything alive that is made up of Ki so this Ki blast should only continue forward, not being able to bend and certainly not explode.
What, just because it was moving it wasn't frozen? Vegeta was just punched out of the safe zone the same and he immediately froze, only stopping after hitting some rubble.

Well, only living beings are affected by the life skip, if at all. Not the entire construct of the physical world. Gravity, etc. continue to function as usual. I would simply argue that Ki-attacks do not apply in this case, because it is just energy itself. 1 Replie(s)

DB Multiverse page 2640

iron leaf 23 February

DrewSaga was saying:

Well, given what happened with Nappa, I don't see Mama Videl coming to the rescue against this, now Papa Gohan on the other hand...

And Gotenks is just incompetent.

But of course, hehe.
For the rescue mission to make sense, it should be organized quickly, so a small group would be advisable. One Piccolo has to stay in the camp because the U1 Namekians probably still can't make the safety bubble as big as Piccolo can. And then someone has to come along who everyone agrees is the strongest person in the group, and optionally someone else who has mastered Kai Kai, since IT is unfortunately not helpful in this situation. We can all quickly imagine what the rescue team will look like, haha.

BladedShard was saying:

So the Ik'l time stop doesn't affect stray ki blasts even after they've left from an unfrozen zone (the Namekian)? Interesting.

That is correct. Energy beams are not affected by Life-Skip at all. For reference, see page 2310, page 2316 and page 2325.

BladedShard was saying:

This Vegeta takes the clown cake for me. Neither Pan nor the Namekian are threats to him, so why not kill them both and be done? "Slowly step away"?? Lmaoo somebody please come kill this fool.

That would be very unwise from a tactical standpoint for Vegeta. Based on his current knowledge, only XXI and his allies with the XXI smoke should be able to move within the Life Skip. Earlier in the chapter, #18 was searching for the (U1) Dragon Balls when she was interrupted by U18. Vegeta essentially helped #18 escape and confronted U18 himself in the process. In order for U13 Vegeta to achieve his goal (access to an infinite number of universes), enemies like U18 could prove to be a problem. Knowing how they can overcome the Life Skip is a top priority.

I mean, imagine if Vegeta had just killed Pan and Luska, and later returned to XXI's base.

XXI:
“So, #18 just told me that she encountered survivors who were not affected by IKL's ability. Did you see them?”

U13 Vegeta:
"Yes. I defeated my alter ego and killed the insects."

XXI:
“You did what?!”

U13 Vegeta:
“Um, I killed them all. What's the problem? I'm a DB villain. That's what we do.”

XXI:
“They obviously weren't the only ones in their group who were capable of doing that! Any potential enemy who gets in our way can be a threat to our plans. Damn it, didn't you pay attention to how I won the DBM tournament in the first place? Knowledge is power! Why didn't you bring them here for interrogation, at least one of them? You're so... stupid!” 1 Replie(s)

DB Multiverse page 2640

iron leaf 23 February

Aw, Mama Videl to the rescue. ... Probably not, but I like the idea that the person from the Z group who has the least experience with ki sensing is the first to see the ki attack with her bare eyes.

Now the question is who will be on the rescue team. They'll definitely send the strongest... cough... Gotenks can handle it, haha. 1 Replie(s)

DB Multiverse page 2640

iron leaf 23 February

Bombero was saying:

Okay given how U13 Vegeta is talking, it's clear that what protects Vegeta from the Life-Stop is something physical that he has to carry on his person. It isn't just some kind of nebulous energy that XXI gave him but an actual item of some sort.

I disagree somewhat. Page 2492 clearly indicates that XXI's smoke protects them from various magical/special abilities, such as Life Skip. Unless you want to consider the physically visible smoke clinging to their bodies as an object, in which case that's fine.

AnyEdge was saying:

"So, which one of you is carrying the protection? We'll (emphasis mine) find out..."

That's a very interesting statement. Initially, that would lead me to believe that the "XXI Smoke" either: 1) allows the villains to communicate with XXI, 2) allow XXI to observe what's going on, or 3) both.

However, reading page 2629 again indicates otherwise. I guess we'll see what happens.

Yes, it seems that passing the smoke from XXI to his allies only showed a one-time vision of XXI's past. There was no lasting, uninterrupted telepathic communication between them.

DB Multiverse page 2639

iron leaf 23 February

Ausgerechnet in diesem Kampf, erkannte man die noch fehlende Präzision von Asura. Wenn man im Verlauf des Kapitels bei Bradock genauer hinguckt, sieht man das. Ist auch verständlich. Es war das erste Hauptkapitel als neuer Hauptzeichner.

DBMultiverse Colors page 505

iron leaf 23 February

Ach, die Anfangsphase von Asura. Da merkte man noch, dass er viele Referenzen verwendet hat. Panel 4 stammt aus einer Reihe anderer Szenen, sowohl aus DB, als auch DBM selbst (Broly vs Vegetto aus Seite 193, beispielsweise).

DBMultiverse Colors page 504

iron leaf 22 February

Looks like Vegeta didn't learn his lesson from page 907. 2 Replie(s)

DB Multiverse page 2639

iron leaf 22 February

@Pan SSJ2.
Of course that won't happen. It doesn't make any sense. She only reached SSJ1 a few days ago. And since then, she hasn't really used it except to help build a shield against ZenBuu. Pan doesn't have the experience or strength for it, even if the emotional trigger could be there at any time (like the loss of her Vegeta, for example). This reminds me too much of Majin Son Bra SSJ2 vs. U18 Bra. Far too many people suggested that U18 Bra would transform into SSJ to fight Majin Bra in the final battle. From every perspective, this suggestion didn't make sense at the time. And I say the same thing here with Pan and SSJ2.

Kongming5 was saying:

knew he would die, Pan is a hostage to negate Gohan and Goku no doubt, emperor vegeta is a coward with no pride

I agree. Vegeta won't kill Pan or Luska. He'll definitely use them as hostages. On the one hand, if he encounters the other heroes, or on the other hand, if he brings them to XXI later. The information that U13 Vegeta can obtain from Pan and Luska could prove to be extremely valuable and much more important than simply killing them.

Ultimate-Perfection was saying:

MUI was saying: Some guys saying our Vegeta should win easily.. True, in normal conditions. But the gap is not that massive that our Vegeta could win without his arms lol. He is not Zen Buu or Vegetto, especially with these disadvantage conditions.
I remember when the novel stated U18 Vegeta in Super Saiyan 2 was equal to U13 Vegeta in Super Saiyan 3.

We've already been there. On the one hand, it's just a novel addition that can be ignored if it conflicts with the comic, since the comic represents the main continuity of DBM. On the other hand, the novel doesn't say that U18 Vegeta in SSJ2 is exactly as strong as U13 Vegeta in SSJ3. It's phrased differently. It's still an outrageous statement that unnecessarily derails power level discussions. If you want, you can reread chapter 148 yourself and form your own opinion.

MATTIA IL DIVINO was saying:

How is Emperor Vegeta only as strong as Vegeta18 ssj 2, while the former could fight toe to toe with Gast during his match against Raichi??

Then it must be a misunderstanding. U13 Vegeta with SSJ3 is about as strong as Buu-Arc Goku SSJ3. The SSJ2 U18 Vegeta vs. SSJ3 U13 Vegeta comparison is based solely on a very short section from the novel, which, in the overall context of DBM, tends to misrepresent details and unnecessarily derail power level discussions.

Jack Bz was saying:

I'm confused. What is the problem that people have with this?

The reason is that, some people have much higher critical expectations of fan fiction than of the original, even though, strictly speaking, if they applied the same standards they apply to DBM to Dragon Ball, they would also spend hours complaining about DB. In addition, only one page is published at a time, and any context, twists, etc., are only revealed later, which is less common when an entire chapter is published. On today's page, if I'm being honest, the only point that makes sense to me is the fact that characters are harmed in different ways in the Frozen.

DB Multiverse page 2638

iron leaf 22 February

Ich muss den Meta-Cooler Film mal wieder gucken. In meiner Erinnerung konnte Cooler niemals den IT, und hat sich stattdessen einfach nur sehr schnell bewegt, beim Kampf gegen Goku. 1 Replie(s)

Vegeta Tales page 83

iron leaf 22 February

Ich mag Videl's Design aus DBS überhaupt nicht, daher bin ich ziemlich kritisch gegenüber dem Design von Videl's Mutter. Es wird eindeutig interpretiert, als hätte Videl ihr Aussehen von ihrer Mutter geerbt, aber in DBZ sieht sie ihrer Mutter überhaupt nicht ähnlich. Der Comic suggeriert, dass DBS das richtige Design ist, weil es das ist, das sie von ihrer Mutter geerbt hat. Und genau das stört mich daran.

Early dayz page 61

iron leaf 22 February

Manchmal vergisst man, dass die Prämisse dieses Comics „Bösewicht vs. Bösewicht” ist. Nur weil die Geschichte aus der Sicht der RR erzählt wird, bedeutet es nicht, dass sie die Guten sind. Das zeigt der Wolfsmann sehr gut auf dieser Seite.

DB RED page 56

iron leaf 22 February

Im letzten Moment ausgewichen, und dann entlang des Strahls auf Cumber zufliegen? Coole Taktik. Also, die Kampfchoreographien gehören definitiv zu den Stärken dieses Comics.

Yamoshi Story page 169

iron leaf 22 February

In der Tat, eine interessant aussehende Attacke.

Yamoshi Story page 168

iron leaf 22 February

Die Seite ist voller Elan. Schon damals war das alles so episch, und jetzt mit Farbe. Juhu, ich freue mich auf mehr.

DBMultiverse Colors page 503

iron leaf 22 February

Ah, das Wort 'Tourist' wurde abgeschnitten und ist nun hinter dem Gebäude versteckt. Ich frage mich, ob das mit Absicht ist, oder weil der Text für die eine spezielle Textbox zu lang, damit es alles reinpasst. Nichtsdestotrotz, super gelöst, indem es so wirkt, als wäre der Stand allgemein verstect in der Ecke. 1 Replie(s)

Super Dragon Bros Z page 226

iron leaf 20 February

Kurisu was saying:

How is he losing??? U18 should've one-shotted u13???

Well, pretty much what Legoman and SoyBear have said in the comment section.

Squirz was saying:

I am still reading this comic from time to time. However, one thing confuses me. Universe 1 Dragon Balls. What makes them so special?

What Osha said. Page 2587 mentioned this.

Kaio K was saying:

Kurisu was saying: How is he losing??? U18 should've one-shotted u13???

It seems the writers favor U13 Vegeta over U18 Vegeta, there were ways he could’ve one-shotted this fraud smh

Are we actually reading the same comic, because up until now, U13 has always been portrayed as the loser Vegeta between the two. And I don't understand where you got the idea that U18 Vegeta would be able to one-shot his counterpart.

supersaiyan2kakarot was saying:

Looks like vegeta's arm shattered when he crashed into that pillar. Though, I wonder why the rest of his body didn't break when he crashed into the debris?

I suspect it's because Vegeta wasn't defeated in the Frozen state, unlike Vegetto. The blow that hit Vegeta was delivered while he was still in his normal state; he then simply flew through the Frozen state.

Cloot was saying:

Vegeta did say he fights his best when he isn't protecting others.

That's right. He said something similar on page 2575.

Bombero was saying:

Yo we’re’s Raditz? Cause I don’t remember seeing him in the legion of villains when XXI was given his exposition speech.

On page 2502, we see Raditz for the last time. After U9 was sent home by South Kaioshin, Raditz somehow managed to talk his way out of it.

DB Multiverse page 2638

iron leaf 20 February

And here goes the second hand.

DB Multiverse page 2638

iron leaf 20 February

Andres was saying:

You are right. I would assume, Cell did not really charge the SBC, thus the power was lacking to really pierce Gohan's hand. Here, we can assume, as Dirty Fireworks doesn't need a real charge to fire the attack, that the entire impact is seen on U18 Vegeta's hand.

CompactCoven was saying:

iron leaf was saying: Aha, Dirty Fireworks didn't completely pulverize and dismember U18 Vegeta's hand, unlike what happened to Saibaman back then in DBZ. So, for the DBM continuity, we can conclude that if you are stronger than the user of Dirty Fireworks, you can survive the attack and won't lose any body parts. You'll just be very seriously wounded.
Makes sense! If they had access to a point-and-click instant kill option that worked on anyone, they'd be spamming it all the time. The only time we've seen this type of attack work (Vegeta vs Saibaman, Vegeta vs Cui, Frieza vs Krillin, Majin Bra vs Piccolo), the user's always been way stronger than the victim

Absolutely right. Sometimes DBM manages to rework certain features of Dragon Ball in an interesting way and explore them in more detail. Kienzan should not be the almighty, unstoppable attack; there should be rules based on power levels. On the other hand, Dirty Firework shows that it was always an attack that humiliatingly tore apart weak opponents, but only caused injury to stronger opponents.

DB Multiverse page 2637

iron leaf 20 February

Vegeta rettet Pan vor dem Dirty Firework. Absolut logisch. Ein anderes Szenario hätte ich mir garnicht vorstellen können. In DBM erhalten Vegeta und Pan wahrlich sehr viel Fokus als Team. Gefällt mir sehr.

DB Multiverse page 2637

iron leaf 18 February

Einer meiner Lieblingskämpfe. Der Hintergrund hinter dem Flashback Panel, das erkennt man, aber ist nicht zu 100% sofort als Flashback ersichtlich. Da wirkt die S/W Version um einen ticken besser.

Edit:
Ich habe einen Fehler gemacht. Natürlich handelt es sich nicht um ein Flashback in Panel 3, sondern um eine von Bardocks Visionen. Allerdings sagt Bardock es so, als hätte er diese Vision nicht jetzt, sondern vor dem Kampf gehabt. In gewisser Weise kann die Platzierung der Vision in diesem Moment als eine kleine Rückblende betrachtet werden.

DBMultiverse Colors page 502

iron leaf 18 February

Oh, was für ein netter Effekt in Panel 7. Gefällt mir sehr.

DBMultiverse Colors page 501

iron leaf 18 February

Oh, armer South, er weiß noch nicht, wie sehr die Leute später seine Autorität buchstäblich missachten werden.

DBMultiverse Colors page 500

iron leaf 18 February

Aha, Dirty Fireworks didn't completely pulverize and dismember U18 Vegeta's hand, unlike what happened to Saibaman back then in DBZ. So, for the DBM continuity, we can conclude that if you are stronger than the user of Dirty Fireworks, you can survive the attack and won't lose any body parts. You'll just be very seriously wounded. 2 Replie(s)

DB Multiverse page 2637

iron leaf 18 February

brolyhater was saying:

On a different note, Vegeta is absolutely not letting Pan die. He'll probably force his hand out to stop the attack, injuring his hand in the process.

What do you think something like that would look like? Would Vegeta's hand be as badly injured as Gohan's arm when he saved Vegeta from Cell's beam in the Cell arc? Or would it be more like Dirty Fireworks, where Vegeta's hand partially collapses in a graphic manner and blood gushes out, comparable to someone blowing off a hand with a shotgun?

mAc Chaos was saying:

Can this Namek heal?

We don't know for sure. The Namekians at their base camp can heal people, and this one (His name is Luska) might be able to as well, but we don't know yet. However, that wouldn't help at the moment anyway, as Namekians apparently cannot heal and use the Life Skip counter at the same time. This was introduced on page 2624.

Thiln was saying:

A minor detail but something that could be pointed out is U13 using his gloved hand to block the attack. Vegeta is technically wearing armor there. It may have blunted some of the impact. Without the glove, that might have left a deep laceration to the wrist instead.

That could be used as an argument, but personally I don't place too much value on the classic Freeza Force Armor. It was said how good the armor was supposed to be, but in practice it never did much good. It's comparable to how in Star Wars the stormtroopers are an elite unit, but their armor can be pierced by simple spears and arrows.

Dolca was saying:

So she dies a second time then?

Ironically, U18 Pan is one of the few characters in the DBM ensemble who has never died yet.

UltraEgo was saying:

Mr Nameless Namek, you better be of the healing type.

I am delighted to announce that the DBM team has decided on a name for the Namekian here.
It's, "Luska".

Ryuzaki_Doragon was saying:

iron leaf 18 February

Autschmenno was saying:

Explodiert jetzt Pans Herz?

U13 Vegeta führt gerade die "Dirty Firework" Technik aus. Unsere Hinweise darauf, wie diese Attacke funktioniert, stammen von Saibaman und Kiwi, die in DBZ von Vegeta getötet wurden, und in DBM von Son Bra, die Piccolo tötete, sowie von Cell, welcher Cell Jr. #1 getötet hat. In allen Fällen sah es so aus, als ob der ganze Körper auf einmal auseinanderfiel. Es gab nie einen Hinweis darauf, dass es vom Herzen ausging oder etwas Ähnliches.

Wie ich gesagt hatte.. in Multivers stirbt keiner dadurch

Wenn du die Kienzan meinst, dann liegst du leider falsch. U9 Krillin tötete Sauzer mit der Kienzan im Turnierkampf auf Seite 149. Oder Gohan. Im MR-Arc feuerte er eine Maxi-Kienzan auf Babidis Wohnung ab und tötete dabei Bardock (Siehe Seite 1575). 1 Replie(s)

iron leaf 16 February

Kalenz was saying:

What's Pan even doing here?

Her best! 😉

Ryuzaki_Doragon was saying:

iron leaf 16 February

War das im Namek Spezial aus Freezers Universum nicht vermerkt gewesen, als krillin die auf Zarbon schmiss, dass die kiezan bei den Multivers storys keinen tödlich verletzen kann?

Ich glaube nicht, ob Salagir das ernst gemeint hat. Denn die U8-Namek-Geschichte wurde nach dem Kampf Krillin gegen Sauzer veröffentlicht, und in dem Turnierkampf sehen wir die deutlichste Darstellung, die es je gab, wie ein Körper durch ein Kienzan zerstückelt wird. 1 Replie(s)

DB Multiverse page 2635

iron leaf 16 February

Mir gefällt das Detail, bei dem der Kienzan nur einen kleinen Schnitt verursacht. Das deutet darauf hin, wie groß der Kraftunterschied sein muss, damit die Wirkung des Angriffs so gewaltig abgeschwächt wird. 1 Replie(s)

iron leaf 16 February

Kaio K was saying:

Looks like a SSJ level Kienzan can’t be lethal to anyone SSJ3 level or higher

Makes sense to me. Far too often we have seen people who are much stronger than others tank attacks as if it were nothing. The fact that the Kienzan causes damage at all speaks volumes for the incredible effectiveness of this technique when the power levels of the opponents are closer to each other.

Of course, one could mention the case of Krillin vs. 2nd Form Frieza. I would argue that the discrepancy in power levels between SSJ1 Pan and SSJ3 Vegeta is vastly greater than that between Krillin and Frieza. Which is why the Kienzan did chop off Frieza's tail. If we take the filler scene with Krillin and Cell here for further comparison, it paints a better picture that a large enough power level difference diminishes a Kienzan's effect.

Northeal was saying:

I like that the kienzan isn't treated as some ultra move that can kill opponents hundreds of times stronger than you. Have it be strong enough so that characters can injury those above their weight class like the KiKoHo, but if it could literally kill anyone then it would feel foolish that not literally everyone is using it.

A logical train of thought.
Just like Zenkai for Saiyans who have already reached SSJ or other various technique combos such as Kamehameha + IT. If it were really that simple, everyone would have used it at every opportunity.

Cebolinha was saying:

Let me add another DBM example. Cell and Cell Jr. #1.

[img]

1 Replie(s)

iron leaf 15 February

I think Pan is experiencing what it feels like to be her grandfather ... her other grandfather. Haha.
I love and admire her dedication though. That's exactly what you'd expect from the next-gen Z-Fighters.

[img]

4 Replie(s)

DB Multiverse page 2635

iron leaf 15 February

Zol was saying:

iron leaf was saying: I don't think we've ever seen so much blonde hair in a DB panel. Haha.

Well, in the Cell Juniors' fight, there are several panels with at least 3 Super Saiyans in the same panel.

https://w...33936ad5e55a948

But if you want to count, on this specific page, we actually have 4 blonde people in just 1 panel! Although 3 of them are quite far back (it's the middle panel).

So technically we have a panel by Akira Toriyama with more blonde people on it, although you might not count them because this panel has the blonde characters more in focus.

https://w...c560af87529d8b8

Touché. 😂
Okay, but what about DBM without DBZ?

kcheeb was saying:

uhh still think this is what he should have done lmfao

honestly would be really funny and anticlimatic lol

maybe some one can draw as parody page or sth later

Okay, that's funny, of course, and could really pass as a mini-comic, haha.

Nevertheless, I would like to mention that it would probably turn out as Sodapopinski already mentioned in the comment section. As soon as U13 Vegeta attacks either the Namekian or Pan, hypothetically speaking, U18 Vegeta would immediately attack his counterpart. And since Dirty Fireworks leaves you briefly open to attack after successful delivery, that would be the end of U13 Vegeta, as U18 Vegeta would take advantage of that without batting an eyelid.

We mustn't forget that U13 Vegeta doesn't yet know who or what is responsible for the trio surviving the Frozen. In his PoV, it could be a technique, it could be an object in the pocket of one of the three. Of course, 1/3 is already a good probability to guess correctly, but it's not a certainty.

iron leaf 14 February

Ich bin ein großer Fan dieser merkwürdigen Situation. Es ist nicht einfach 1-vs-1, sondern es gibt einen Twist, durch den unser Vegeta einen enormen Nachteil hat, den er irgendwie überwinden muss. Ich liebe auch den SSJ3-Schlagabtausch. So etwas haben wir in DBM noch nicht gesehen. SSJ3-Tierkämpfer, die miteinander kämpfen, gab es schon, auch wie sie gemeinsam gegen jemanden anderen kämpfen. Allerdings noch nicht, wie sie gegeneinander kämpfen.

Allerdings muss ich eine kleine Kritik äußern. Auch wenn mir der Haarwirrwarr aufgrund der vielen Action-Linien, der vielen Haare und der Effekte sehr gefällt, erkenne ich nur schwer, was sich gerade im Bild abläuft.

Ryuzaki_Doragon was saying:

iron leaf 14 February

Meine Rede. 😂

Early dayz page 58

iron leaf 14 February

Ich weiß es wirklich sehr zu schätzen, dass Loopwhirl und Nedwook unterschiedliche Haarfarben haben. Das macht es doch ein bisschen einfacher. In der Schwarz-Weiß-Version musste man immer darauf achten, wie sich die Haarspitzen kräuseln.

DBMultiverse Colors page 499

iron leaf 14 February

Hab ich irgendwas vergessen, aber wann wurden beide buus betroffen, da der Dicke bereits in seinem Universum war, als Zenbuu eingesperrt wurde

Oh, das habe ich falsch formuliert. Verzeih. Ich meinte, auch wenn wir nicht sehen, wie sowohl Buu aus U4 als auch Buu aus U11 mit demselben Bannspruch versiegelt werden. Sehen wir zumindest, dass der Zauber tatsächlich bei Buu noch wirkt.

DBMultiverse Colors page 498

iron leaf 14 February

Je mehr Zeit vergeht, desto mehr Gelegenheit hat Cumber, sich an Yamoshis SSJ anzupassen. Geh in die Offensive und lass den Mörder deiner Frau nicht alles tun, was er will – auch wenn du ihn retten möchtest.

[img]

1 Replie(s)

Yamoshi Story page 167

iron leaf 14 February

Die Farben stechen echt gut heraus. Es sieht so minimalistisch aus. Das hat ein gewissen Flair.

DB RED page 52

iron leaf 14 February

foiopaulo was saying:

I was thinking that maybe, if Red Stripe is a Goku clone/android hybrid, wouldn't the wolf be one version of this with Yamcha cells, and the mime one a version of Chiaotzu..?

Just food for thought.

That's a really interesting thought. It would fit in with DBZ, where Gero collected samples from Goku's battles. The idea of developing a counterpart for each Z Fighter sounds very exciting.

DB RED page 52

iron leaf 13 February

I don't think we've ever seen so much blonde hair in a DB panel. Haha. 1 Replie(s)

iron leaf 12 February

So nebenbei, ich finde die Architektur in der Hauptstadt ziemlich interessant. Sie sehen etwas anders aus, als die Gebäude auf Freezer's Planeten.

Vegeta Tales page 79

iron leaf 11 February

Xicor was saying:

Also ich sage voraus, dass Vegeta gewinnt.

Was ist, wenn keiner von beiden gewinnt? Vielleicht eine Art Doppel-K.O.
Dann stehen Pan und der Namekianer allein da und C18 kommt zurück. Das wäre ein krasser Cliffhanger.

DB Multiverse page 2633

iron leaf 11 February

Wow, Pan has grown up, literally. Her leg is super long. 1 Replie(s)

DB Multiverse page 2633

iron leaf 11 February

Trunks wirkt in dieser Darstellung eher wie der kleine Bruder von Son Bra. Irgendwie erweckt DBM manchmal den Eindruck, als würde es vergessen, dass Trunks eigentlich 10 Jahre älter als seine Schwester ist. Goten und Trunks sollen jedoch eindeutig als albern dargestellt werden, und der beste Weg, eine kindliche Ader zu vermitteln, ist, die Figur kindlich aussehen zu lassen.

Außerdem finde ich es großartig, wie Babidis Hypothese hier vorgestellt wird, und dann viel später getestet wird und sich tatsächlich bewahrheitet. Super Vorhersage. 1 Replie(s)

DBMultiverse Colors page 498

iron leaf 11 February

Ehrlich gesagt, diese Ansage von C48 hier ist eigentlich viel uncooler, als mal auf die Fresse zu bekommen.

DB RED page 51

iron leaf 11 February

Man würde erwarten, der Kameramann hätte genug Selbsterhaltungstrieb, um den Imperator nicht in Verlegenheit zu bringen, indem er die Kamera direkt auf seine bevorstehende Demütigung richtet. Cooler wird sich den Typen merken, falls er überleben sollte, haha.

Vegeta Tales page 78

iron leaf 11 February

Cooler: "Did i leave the stove on?" xD

Vegeta Tales page 76

iron leaf 11 February

Oh nein, ein Heiratsantrag über das Fernsehen. Sie kann nicht einmal darauf antworten. Wie peinlich. Nun, vielleicht finden es einige Leute rührend.

Early dayz page 57

iron leaf 11 February

Magische Bohnen in Dragonball? Haha. Aber natürlich, lass mich raten: Wenn er sie in der Erde vergräbt, wächst eine riesige Bohnenstange aus dem Boden, die so hoch ist, dass man sie erklimmen kann. 1 Replie(s)

Super Dragon Bros Z page 224

iron leaf 11 February

Unglaublich schlechter Plan von West. Zum Glück hat sie nicht das Sagen.

DBMultiverse Colors page 497

iron leaf 10 February

Meiner Meinung nach schien mir Yamoshi viel zu stark, um auch nur eine einzige Verletzung davonzutragen.
Im Umkehrschluss würde das bedeuten, Kanba hätte den Kampf viel früher gewinnen müssen. Wenn er wirklich gewinnen wollte, hätte er das tun müssen, bevor Yamoshi sich verwandelte.

Yamoshi Story page 166

iron leaf 10 February

misi was saying:

As much as I always loved Asura's drawings, over the years the style really started to shift away from being super close to what the original dbz was like - Well, at least what we understand as "dbz style" (There are so many specific ones, mange, anime, and even within both media there are tons of artists - so let's say a style that is very close to the anime (or artwork in certain games) - not one specific artist's work, more like an happy amalgamation of "most".
I am not saying it's bad, but it is becoming more and more like some other anime altogether with the curves and corners being this dramatic, noses, facial expressions, etc. It just makes the "fan" aspect of the fan manga a bit more, hmm... apparent? Do you see what I mean?

So what? Nobody expects a Toriyama, Yamamuro, Maeda, or Nakatsuru in a fan manga, and those who do should probably just avoid reading fan manga altogether.

SoyBear was saying:

OOf, I think Kakarot's words from page 2270 (and Vegeta's own words) got to him.

That's an interesting detail you bring up. In your example, U13 Vegeta partially admits (that there is a possibility) that U18 Vegeta is stronger than him. Perhaps in a quiet moment and with a clear mind, he is much more open with himself in his assessment. His last sentence on this page gives the impression that he does not want to accept that his counterpart is stronger, which makes him disillusioned.

iron leaf 10 February

Grabnatz was saying:

Das heißt nach Salagirs Logik hat die Baseform immer limits? Das heißt Goku könnte immer nur dann stärker werden wenn er eine immer wieder neues Stufe erreicht? Irgegdwie ein super dummes limit oder nicht? Gleichzeitig auch ne starke Limitierung aller die sich nicht verwandeln können

Die Alternative. Goku in Base-Form kann allein durch Training Vegetto in einem ernsthaften und fairen Schlagabtausch besiegen.

iron leaf 9 February

Nassif9000 was saying:

i love the cool little detail of his hair being chopped off since 17 and 18 broke it during the previous time freeze LOL

Oh my goodness, I only noticed that after reading your comment. Indeed, in Asura's main chapters, U13 Vegeta's hairstyle follows the new detail that the tip at the front was broken off during the life skip and has been depicted that way ever since. Admittedly, we've only seen U13 Vegeta once since the IKL incident, if you ignore CH105. But considering how this detail can also be seen here as SSJ2, I find it all the more fascinating. Hopefully, Asura can maintain this without making continuity errors, as was the case with the occasional missing M symbol during the MR-Arc.

[img]

LMAO was saying:

Gotta say U13 Vegeta having this sheepish reaction over a "ask who loves him" question is completely out of character for saiyan/Freeza saga Vegeta, while he definetely would've said something like he did in the second panel he wouldn't look flustered at all doing so, he would have a unwavering confidence on his own words and considering his status as emperor of his own universe far more so than he did back at the saiyan saga.

Well, then it's a good thing that this is DBM-Arc Vegeta and not Saiyan-Arc Vegeta. Besides, we have already seen U13 Vegeta behave this way, also because of a comment made by Pan (Page 1352). 1 Replie(s)

iron leaf 9 February

Nassif aus dem englischen Kommentarbereich hat darauf hingewiesen, dass Vegeta's Haar genau an der Stelle abgehackt aussieht, an der C17 ihm während des IKL-Life-Skips eine Strähne abgebrochen hat. Das kann man auf Seite 2312 noch einmal nachgucken und mit den Haaren auf der heutigen Seite vergleichen. Eine wirklich starke Art der visuellen Kontinuität. Hoffentlich kann Asura das beibehalten.