WukongTheMighty was saying: J.I.L was saying: WukongTheMighty was saying: And here's the crux of the issue of elaborating on the future, Gohan not getting strong enough to beat the androids in hindsight is a really really weird plot idea. The Androids arc in the original manga is a very confused arc due to editor meddling. Why is Gohan too weak in the future despite training to defeat them for over a decade? He just is.
It's something that you're better off just trying to ignore because Future Gohan simply makes no sense considering "Gohan gets angry and can easily win" is the whole climax of the Androids arc.
Any sort of elaboration on that plot hole is just going to widen it, so you really are better off just ignoring it.
It makes sense. He dosen't have gravity training, HTC training nor does he have otherworld. And in DBM lore... the androids when they 1st arrived were as strong as present timeline against weaker future Z characters. It's actually impressive and fitting he was as strong as he was.

And I defintley dissagree. This chapter is super hype. The elaboration of teen Future Gohan training with Roshi is must see manga.

Uh huh, whatever you say. The issue with all of this in particular is that it's a foregone conclusion. Whatever training Roshi is about to give Gohan is the same training that leads to him losing an arm and then later leads to his corpse laying face down in a muddy puddle. Also, there's problems with there not being gravity training. Bulma doesn't just cease to exist and could have made a gravity training room. She just doesn't because of reasons. The lack of HTC training also only makes sense if Goku decides not to just use King Kai to relay a message to Gohan. Or ask Baba to use his one day to instruct Gohan on what to do, etc.
There's no logical reason why this doesn't happen either. "Oh, the afterlife is silent" is something I hear bandied about sometimes, but that doesn't make much sense on account of... well how did they deal with Namek if that were the case? King Kai collaborating with Kami and Guru was quite important. Did Goku never end up fighting Grandpa Gohan as one of Baba's fighters in this universe? Wouldn't that have led to his tail not coming off?
Or did the Otherworld just arbitrarily shut after the Namek Arc for no reason?
See, it's all stuff like this that leads actually elaborating on the future timeline to always end up being a mess where absolutely bizarre nonsense like "Gohan who isn't even as strong as a weakened 17 can somehow go toe-to-toe with a guy on Perfect Cell's level and even break out of a grapple." has to happen.

I have never seen anybody able to write a satisfying reason for why the future went the way it did, the only explanation is that... well it just DID. It's something that Toriyama seemingly realized didn't make all that much sense and kept fairly vague in how it was presented, it can't be explained because any sort of detailed dissection makes the entire plot of the future fall to pieces.

I always figured the issue is simply that Gohan has immense potential but doesn't know how to access it. We see that Piccolo and Vegeta are both dead so he has no "real" mentors. Roshi, as well meaning as he is, isn't moving the needle with any training he can offer. Goku in this timeline has virtually no clue of the depths of Gohan's strength, of which he only really discovered during their training together.

Also keep in mind this Gohan is far weaker initially than the Gohan we follow due to him not knowing about the Androids beforehand or training.

There's also the fact that Freeza is a galactic emperor while the Androids are solely planetary. They don't even wipe out all humans on Earth despite it being several decades since showing up.

Goku coming back was thanks to Baba and we don't know her whereabouts. You could argue that New Namek should have gotten involved but even then it's murky since it's unclear if Porunga can bring people back a second time.

I think the big challenge with the future timeline is that shit hits the fan very fast and at the most inopportune time. Goku dies without believing there's a level beyond SS, Vegeta barely gets SS before dying, Piccolo dies thus getting rid of Dragon Balls, and Gohan is pretty much at Namek-saga level, relying on his Saiyan-saga training methods

Honestly, it can be argued that it's because of Gohan's impressive potential that he got as strong as he did in the first place. Future Trunks is a perfect example of what shit training vs real training can do

The presenter seems to be of the same species as the king of the milky way.

Oh, by the way, why doesn't the galactic patrol appear in Multiverse? Before you tell me that Super is not canon, remember that the galactic patrol was created before Super.

Even Salagir years ago said that Jaco's manga had occurred in some universes (except Minus), I suppose he retracted it over time, but if Slug appeared out of nowhere and creating many doubts, I have hope that the clueless super elite patrolman Jaco will appear in this fantastic story.

Edit: I just remembered that Jaco does appear in Multiverse, I think it was when universe 2 retired, I'm not satisfied, Jaco deserves more.

Stevethebarbarian was saying: Who cares if it came before DBS? So did Bleach, but it’s not canon to DBM either. The only DBM canon is the Dragon Ball manga and the Toei movies that Salagir likes, plus a few old Toriyama gag characters in Universe 2, but they’re basically irrelevant to the overall canon.
Jaco's manga is on a much higher level than any Toei film, because his manga was written personally by Akira, and he is also referenced in Multiverse, in the chapter about Kakarot as a child page 1666 (although I think that was more of an inconsistency XD).

It is a story that is found in the Dragon Ball universe, in a non-humorous way, totally canon, which reveals to us that Bulma has a sister and that Goku could have been killed early if he was not lucky.

Chronos was saying: ...wait.
Does Roshi think Krillin wants training to be a pick up artist?
Ahah, Kaioh style!
I didn't think of that. Too late, but I like the idea!

IronDBZ was saying: BangBang was saying: You mean Broly is not interesting, Buu? OK.
Ugh, don't remind me of DBM Broly.

To this date, I will never like it and I'm so glad that plotline has been (hopefully) resolved.
The thing that confuses me is why vegeta in that universe didnt go ssj3 if it was identical to u18.Also how buu couldn't kill broly.

You mean Broly is not interesting, Buu? OK.

What I find interesting is why universe 16 feels guilt and shame about vegito. Vegito is just goku and vegeta fused. Yet bringing up goku and vegeta seems... painful, taboo or annoying to them. Like there is insecurity there. What is the problem with them being fused?
For vegito, I guess in the back of his mind the sayain pride in him feels ashamed for having to resort to fusion instead of being able to defeat Buu with his own as power as goku and vegeta. And his literal existence is a testament and reminder to that weakness. It's so meta.

Universe 14, what happened to make us lose so badly?

Seriously? I could think of more than 3 scenarios on the top of my head. Trunks universe is the odd one, not the other way around.

He just recognized his Girlfriend... Videl :D

If there is one thing I can count on, it's DBM commenters to be excessively negative and ungrateful.

I'm interested to see where this special goes, and I loved the last arc!

funny that the kaios dont like buu being in control, but they have been in control of their universe killing anything that could opose them even if that something was not trying to do them any harm. now they are at the receiving end of that, but instead of being killed, they are spared and even helped, and still, they only want to kill to protect their supremacy

Why is Videl going?

The filler humor is a part of the dragonball experience, but this is very annoying since we're all on pins and needles for the plot to progress.

Berrizo.... Oh, boy.... Here we go.

Honestly, his art style, while not my favorite, and a bit wacky, ain't bad.

The poorly-written special he was given is what was bad (bojack special).

Maybe this one will be different.


IronDBZ was saying: Somehow, this feels like an insult.

The art has improved majorly from the last time Berrizo did a special.


Y.O.U.R always made that special fun to read, even if the chapter itself wasn't.


Whatever happened to that guy? He was funny as hell.

bmilsart was saying:
No. This is fine.
Show, don't tell.
All the people complaining about the pacing don't understand that it is important for the finished product. It might feel slow now, but it'll be better for future readers, and on a reread.
You can't judge the pacing of a story by reading it as each page is released, you have to do it once the chapter is finished.
Be patient people.

Consider: we still have not seen U16 Pan's reaction to U16 Gohan being bisected by Bra. Why? Because if Pan actually asked Bra why she did that, or even reacted to it, that would make Bra look bad. There is no reason not to see this scene, yet instead, we've skipped over it. Why?

Instead, we have jumped straight to Vegito--as in-character as it is for him--kicking Bra. It's the exact same shindig as the flashback: an adult authority figure on both feet contrasted with a crying young girl on the ground and defenseless. (Note the goshdarn panel of her big, innocent, teary eyes!) Except now he's physically hurting her.

Vegito is not being portrayed as in the right here, or even justified in his anger.

If Vegito isn't in the right, then Bra is undeserving of this treatment, and therefore she is in the right.

Bra murdered all these people and she is in the right.

This is literally the exact worst possible outcome of this rebellion: Bra turns evil, kills everyone, breaks the seal by herself, apologizes, then immediately has Vegito not only not accept her apology, but physically abuse her so we feel sorry for her. Sigh.

this entire thing is basically vegito's fault yet he's too proudful to take the blame for it and instead pins it on bra not being "responsible enough", well here's my response to him: maybe if you actually taught her how to control herself and how to act accordingly, WE WOULDN'T BE IN THIS SITUATION NOW WOULD WE?!

This chapter has become a test for the readers, to bring out fans who will be ranked from indecent to scumbag. There are people who are either defending Vegito's cruelty and borderline evil or shitting on Son Bra for something she wasn't at fault for and more. These next chapters will show who among us are indecent human beings. Vegito is an awful father to the point where calling him a father would be an insult to fathers. He forced Son Bra into a world of fighting and bloodshed at a young age, convinced her of awful, untrue things, as well as had her blame herself for things she didn't do on purpose, will not give her the proper help she needs, and really feel no love anymore. Vegito is obsessed with power to the point where it has corrupted him. He finds himself fit to decide who lives and who dies, including Son Bra, who he felt no shame in sharing his true feelings with. And it's appalling to think I am among fans who are defending his abuse and worse. For starters, what he does is not like spanking a child. In fact, spanking is wrong in it of itself, period. Vegito is so close to wrongfully killing Son Bra, if he isn't planning on it now, and he's going to do it wholeheartedly believing nobody can stop him, because just like Goku, Vegeta and gang are gonna debate, Vegito is a threat. What I fear is, not that Vegito will kill Son Bra, but that people will be supportive of Vegito's decision to commit murder. You know, the guy who's revered as a god in his universe and is supposed to be some kind of space cop.

Now we have Son Bra. You know what I see when I read that speech bubble and look at that face? No, I saw that face at the first page, at least. An abused child, not just physically, but mentally as well. She's tragic, and nobody feels anything for her except distaste, it's absurd. When it comes to Vegito and Son Bra's characters and their 'relationship', the way so many people talk about them in such inhumane ways make it sound like they (the fans) are like this in real life, which is concerning. Remember when Vegito threatened to kill Son Bra? He left her in the middle of outer space on the remnants of a destroyed planet, where the star was about to go supernova. He told her to find Earth and the Dragon Balls to restore everything, all by herself. Just finding Earth seemed impossible for Son Bra, and she was a child then, plenty younger than she is now. Two fans were arguing in the comments section on a, or the last page of the chapter that showed the full story up to when Vegito threatened Son Bra, because one of them was anti-Son Bra. The user who hated Son Bra, their arguments were inhuman, and he went as far as to bring up how much they only cared about the fights Son Bra brought to the table, though what I said could be slightly off. Son Bra is looked down on for so many terrible, pitiful and petty reasons, and I condemn them.

So everyone, don't let this comment stop you from bringing out how you feel about Son Bra and Vegito, it'll not only judge you as humans, but if you're single, it'll judge you as future parents or if you'll ever be one. I know Son Bra and Vegito are fictional characters, I'm fully aware, in fact, but like I said, the way certain people here express their opinions makes them seem as if this is how they are irl, which I hate. If you wanna prove me wrong, that what you say about these two characters and their actions do not reflect how you are in real life, comment and explain yourself, I'd genuinely love to hear this, because I believe in humanity and I hate looking down on others.

Man, Asura's art is so good! I like what the other artists do, but nothing beats this or Toyotarou (DB AF/Super).

Asura is legit the best DB artist of all time.