This'd be around the time the Saiyans invaded, right? Maybe the mother gets killed by Nappa 1 Replie(s)

Yeah he really only needed SSJ2 for this to be fully effective, but I think Goku may have panicked

There we have it folks, Goku's finally about to play catch with his dad

I mean, until we see if she can hurt him or not, we can't judge if it's a stupid idea. Plus, he's putting all his effort and brain power into engaging U18 Vegeta, if he sees a fist flying towards him, he's going to instinctually block it, even if it is a nothing hit because he can't risk the chance of it stunning him for even a milisecond 1 Replie(s)

Not disagreeing but is it really that unrealistic for Pan to be around 18's level? She managed to damage Kakarot (U13) with an uppercut and was strong enough in her base to make him transform. And both kid Trunks and Goten managed to hold their own against a fully maintinanced, possibly stronger A18 in the Buu saga, and they were both much younger than Pan.
She may not seem that strong, but remember she's been trained by Goku over the past decade, I wouldn't underestimate her 1 Replie(s)

Ok, is it just me or does "Replant another forest for 400 years" sound off to you guys? Maybe if it was just "Replant trees for 400 years" or just "Replant another forest" it'd be fine 1 Replie(s)

"Look at me, I'm a Super Saiyan!"
Oh well it's going well for Vegeta now, but just wait til Cooler transforms

SSJ might not be a 50x multiplier in this story

He can use any of his techniques in his base form, the only reason he uses it in SSJ is because it's more efficient to transform than use a finisher move 1 Replie(s)

Ghast can read other people's hearts, and Thorn got a bunch of data(?) of people relevant in this war. They probably found out about Vomi and Bulma was able to make a bootleg android version of her, possibly using the remains of the android they destroyed earlier. That's my guess anyway

I've only seen it in filler/GT, but I interpreted it as "Goku learns fast, so spamming the same attack against him won't work as he'll learn how to avoid or counter it. Nothing to do with their biology, but I could be wrong 1 Replie(s)

Salagir created both the life-stop technique, and the solution to the life-stop technique, in a series with a bunch of other nonsensical magical elements in it.
So it makes sense because he says so, not because there's some inherit logic behind it. It makes almost as much sense as the life-stop technique itself

I wonder if Juna can really leave that dimension, I always imagined the Buu-beings were anchored to the dimension they were in. If that's the case, it'd be cool if Uub had to absorb Juna to take her with him and become something like Majuub. Juub.

58 years is insane, especially with how quickly we've seen people improve in Dragon Ball. I wonder if she's taking the Kaioken into account or not, it'd make much more sense (To me at least) if she wasn't

Very nice Goku hair styled pot plant

The human (Or whatever Uub is) body needs rest in order to reap the results of training, constantly pushing yourself without adequate rest or nutrition only staggers results, or worse, make you go backwards. Anime's fooled us into thinking you can constantly work out to get stronger but that's not entirely how it works irl.

Now, tbf, I don't think that's what's happening here, Uub definitely is getting stronger. But because he's been pushing himself non-stop with minimal rest, he's in a constant state of exhaustion, and isn't at peak performance.
Maybe if Uub does well enough against her, she'll give him a longer break, and he'll have a chance to actually beat her. 1 Replie(s)

So does this imply that Bojack's stronger than Dabura? Because Cell didn't powerup against Dabura and I would assume he's at least a bit tougher than Bojack. 1 Replie(s)

This is absolutely phenomenal, as someone who's proficient with those programs I can appreciate how much skill, time and effort went into this, great job! And yes, our boy Uub can take anything Juna has to throw at him

For those saying Uub's OP because of his candification combat, there's more. Uub can use the Kaioken for an extended period since he can just heal himself after his body sustained too much damage.

Goku and Buu really are making a monster... 1 Replie(s)

Kakarot: So there is still a little Saiyan in you!
Pan: I give up.
Gohan: There's a little Goku in there too...

To be fair Vegito could blitz these suckers in a heartbeat, so my prediction's that XXI takes away the energy his 'senzu bean' gave him, and leave him starved 1 Replie(s)

While I have nothing against Goku winning, let's be real. There's multiple fighters that would've beaten Goku had he gone up against them.
I'K'L (If he'd been born)
Tapion (Possibly, and only after controlling Hirudegarn)
Vegito
Broly
Gotenks (From U18 specifically, after learning how to fuse better)
Zen Buu
Bra (After controlling her SSJ2 form)
Raichi (Possibly, only in the later rounds, and if Goku didn't go for the kill immediately)
Ghast Carcolh (Possibly).

Either way, I can't wait to see how this fight goes. Hopefully it spans more than a single chapter 1 Replie(s)

Damn, I kinda liked those Universe 9 guys. I wonder though, if all of them could get sent home with the push of a button, could they be brought back the same way? Be kinda interesting if the last resort to beat Vegito/XXI was to bring back Zen Buu

I'm guessing there's nothing actually wrong with the senzu bean, it's just a kind gesture. But it's a way for XXI to get on Vegito's good side, less chance of him attacking XXI

It is. He doesn't have the weird marble thing on his head, his skin colour's different, and his weird ear thing is shut 2 Replie(s)

Honestly, I've enjoyed this comic more than some of the other stuff here on the website. Nice to see some of the easy ways the Z-warriors were able to beat Broly. I'm not gonna pretend like this is some grade-A piece of work - It definitely has its flaws, but as a harmless piece of action, I enjoyed it for what it was 1 Replie(s)

Time travel doesn't do that, I assumed it was because there was no one on Earth to really challenge Gero and 19. He wasn't forced to awaken 17 & 18 like the Future or other timelines since Gero could just take care of everyone himself 1 Replie(s)

Honestly, I don't think Goku or the others were all that dumb with their planning earlier. Goku and Vegeta's plan to beat someone tougher than them has always been "Out muscle them and overpower them", and even when that was never an option... Their plan's always been "Out muscle them and overpower them". Them wanting to outmuscle an outmuscleable opponent isn't out of character for them, and I would even go so far as to say the plans they DID come up with was smarter than anything they did in DBZ/DBS.
If anything, them midmaxing like this to try and oneshot Broly seems out of character, we'd never EVER see this in any official series.

But hey, since we're committed to trying to kill Broly straight away instead of giving him a fair go, let's see what they COULD do to try and kill Broly.
Dabura's spit, have SSJ3 Gogeta use his soul punisher on Broly immediately, have Buu absorb Guldo, Gohan & Gogeta, use the timestop ability and wail on him, carbonite, Ginyu's body swap ability, have Piccolo use with all the remaining Namekians and use Gast's power block technique on him before jabbing his heart out, have Buu candy-beam him, Mafuba, Devilman's power, maybe Babidi's mind control powers.
So there are some options out there, but again, even with planning these just seem too... Unfair to use? Too cheap? Idk if Vegeta or Goku's pride would let Kibito execute those plans even if it did mean the end of everything 1 Replie(s)

Pretty sure that Trunks's time travelling itself never actually changed anything, Trunks just thought it did due to his lack of understanding of time travel. This is all speculation on my part, but 19 and Gero were so weak that even in the future timeline, the Z-Fighters were able to beat them, and because of how short lived they were, Bulma probably never thought to bring them up. They still existed in both timelines.

16 was also probably around in the future timeline, but the difference in circumstances prevented the Androids from noticing him, leaving him locked up in the pod for all those decades.
As for 17/18 getting stronger, it's debated whether they actually are weaker in the future or not. Some say that just like when they killed Future Gohan, the Androids were just holding back against Trunks to toy around with him. And by the time Trunks could destroy them, he was too strong to tell the difference. Or, we could take DBM's logic that they got weaker over time. 1 Replie(s)

That's exactly what I was saying earlier. Time travel really isn't that complicated yet they messed it up anyway, all for the sake of a story that I don't even think is good tbh. 1 Replie(s)

Daaaamn man! Come out Buffrunga

Gast ain't liking the awards he got, which fair enough. One of them's for murdering people which we know he doesn't like doing, and the other is for stopping Buu... Even though he was annihilated during Buu's second rampage

Because that wasn't Akira's logic, it never was. At best, it was Trunks's assumption that that's how time travel worked, but nothing confirmed that him travelling to the past actually caused any immediate changes. Even if Trunks was onto something, the changes in the past (Stronger/more androids) could be explained by his other visit into the past 3 years earlier.
Plus, Akira had the excuses of tight deadlines where he was having to often think of the story on the spot. This manga has no such excuse, and should be trying to make time travel more consistent rather than less consistent.

I'll comment again in a few pages when the relevant moments come up, since I probably come off as some crazy rambler

It would be kinda funny if the lack of any awards or honourable mentions resulted in Vegito snapping

Oh god no... I think I've seen this manga before from Mondo Cool. If it's the manga I'm thinking of, I don't like it because it does something incredibly dumb and vomits all over how time travel works.
You know how DBM goes to great lengths to give the different timelines consistency since DBZ didn't do a great job at it? Like, why are 17 & 18 stronger in the past compared to the future, and why is there an extra android? Who took care of Frieza and Cold the first time around? DBM shows that 17 & 18 got weaker over time, 16 DID exist but was forgotten, and Goku was the one who took Frieza & Cold out.
Nothing changes unless there's a reason for it to change, and I love that, that makes sense.

This manga, from memory, spits in the face of all that effort, and takes the lazy way out, showing that things can just change for no reason at all just because it's a different timeline. Why did 17 & 18 get stronger? Time travel. Why is 16 in the past but not the future? Time travel. Why do the events about to happen in this manga happen? Time travel. It sucks, and I hate it.

And yes I know I'm the negative one this time around. I had to get these grievances out because I genuinely do have a grudge against this manga. But, the art is alright, and the action's cool I guess. I'm not gonna spout negativity on every page like others have done in the past. I hope everyone else can enjoy this manga even if I don't. I already know what happens, so peace. 1 Replie(s)

XXI did nothing wrong there. A forfeit only counts if the organisers can clearly hear it. If the organisers didn't hear it but a Namekian did, then the 'forfeit' only counts once the organisers are told that someone said they forfeit. The second the organisers announced that the match was over, XXI stopped attacking, so he's in the right here.
Otherwise someone could just whisper "I forfeit" so quietly that no one could hear, get punched by the opponent, and expect to win just because they said they forfeited all along.

You serious? That's ridiculous, didn't Broly bleed in the Second Coming movie? I get that Salagir wants Broly to come off as invincible and normally unbeatable, but he canonically bleeds in the movies when he's in LSSJ (Mostly just Second Coming though) 2 Replie(s)

I believe it drains the fusion time, just not reducing it down to under 5 minutes like it does for Gotenks. It's still more efficient to stay in base when possible, to just add a few extra minutes to the fusion

Please keep in mind that for many of us who're keeping up with the manga, we saw XXI holding the Dragon Ball 6 years ago, and saw XXI talking to the dragon about 10~ years ago. Of course we're gonna forget, I completely forgot until I saw a comment about it last page. And without that extra context, seeing the random stone orbs is quite confusing and jarring.

Personally I think that's a custom made dragon made by XXI, or someone XXI has held hostage. Their wishes are probably very limited compared to Porunga or Shenrons, in exchange for a shorter recharge time (24~ hours), or maybe he's using some time manipulation magic to make the balls age faster.
If I had to guess, he'll use one of the wishes to restore his universe, so that he can eat it all over again. Too bad he erased that segment of Buu earlier, he could've eaten it as a little morsel 1 Replie(s)

Something better? Mate that sounds awesome, I was just about to type "XXI will defuse Gast into his base 100 Namekians". Hopefully it's that one, even if Nail ends up dying as a result

Like always I'll give this story the benefit of the doubt instead of judging it. Maybe Videl had a bigger drive than all of these other fighters. She ended up getting stronger than her father in U18 despite having no reason to do so 1 Replie(s)

Oh my god, I called it! With the increased access to resources, Gero was able to make Cell even earlier than he did in the other timeline. It's only a few years earlier btw so it's a lot sooner

Ok, double posting, sorry.
Just giving my 2 cents about this drama. While some genuine critisism here and there's absolutely fine (This comic does need it), some of the comments on here are just flat out being rude and disrespectful while trying to hide it under the guise of 'critisism'. It can be soul crushing to push something you're passionate about and get shat on for it without anything constructive being said, so I can understand why Sayazur wouldn't want to read it. He's not saying he's not taking any critisism, he just doesn't want to read disrespectful comments.


And this is exactly the kind of stuff I'm talking about. It's just plain rude and disrespectful and it's uncalled for. Saying something is 'garbage' isn't constructive, it's just bullying.

Just to be clear, I'm not 100% on Sayazur's side, he could've definitely handled things better. But the DBM community (Mostly English by the sounds of it) seems to have a lot of bullying/negativity. I thought it would've ended when WukongTheMighty got banned, but I guess that's never really gonna go away huh?
With that said, can we please just have something without shitting all over it, and start a comment war? 1 Replie(s)

Damn, assuming he's gonna appear in the next few pages, Janemba's really getting a lot of attention ain't he? He appeared in the main DBM comic, it looks like he's appearing here in a bit, and there's that DBS Janemba leak that's going around.
I doubt Janemba could actually do anything himself, but him being created might literally make Broly impossible to kill due to there being no checkout station. Broly can bypass death itself

Everyone was picked up around the same time, so about 22 years from now

The Dragon Ball Z Budokai 3 opening where Broly punches Gogeta? That's pretty good XD

So we're all in agreement right? That kick should've sent Broly's head flying into another dimension

I kinda called it last page, think I was the only who thought they were a later batch of Androids (I said 21 & 22 but that still counts right?)


Actually... I wonder. If Gero's alive and has access to more of Earth's resources/man power (Due to enslavement), I wonder if he could speed up Cell's growth, allowing him to appear sooner than 785. Cause that's 13 long years away, implying that Gast makes a repeat trip there, and that Gero's basement lab makes it out of this chapter unscathed as I could see Thorn finding it and reporting it to Gast

My guess is that this is Androids 21 & 22. Maybe Gero didn't (have to) unleash 17 & 18 in this universe, and took out most of the Z-Fighters with just 19 and himself. So, to get rid of the stragglers, he made more androids building off of 19's design, but improved, so that he didn't have to rely on 2 Androids that he had trouble with in the past.

Are they allowed to show this? Is this actually ok? I was under the impression we wouldn't/couldn't see Gogeta until he possibly appears in the DBM tournament, that way there'd be this whole "Oh wow they made Gogeta canon afterall!" moment later on but I guess not.

Also, it's been said to death, but if Gogeta SSJ3 were to fight Broly, by all rights he should one-shot him considering that a stronger Broly struggled with SSJ1 Vegito. However, I have a theory I haven't seen passed around the comments sections. What if Broly's power somehow resets, or being frozen in ice for so long regresses his power backwards 1 Replie(s)

The problem is, that's the most efficient way to take down XXI (Which might not even work), but fighters very rarely take the most efficient route to beating someone, since their adrenaline's running high, and every second counts. It's impossible to think of every possible scenario that could work and pick out the most effective strategy, seconds before the fight starts or as the fight's happening.

Plus XXI's someone who's hard to predict, he's hard to plan against. Everyone else's plans to thwart him ended in defeat. Even if Gast could restart the fight knowing about Janemba, I doubt it'd change much cause he's that tricky. Plus he did fire a blast at XXI near the start of the match, so he's already done more than 99% of DB characters

I both hope not and hope so. Hope not cause that'd be tragic, but hope so because he might be able to provide some insight into XXI. He'd probably start freaking out.




I think Goku's still alive in U7. He'd have about 4-5 years to get stronger without any of the Namek amps, and maybe he could avoid getting the heart virus this time around. Plus, knowing Vegeta, he's gonna head back to Earth after achieving SSJ to enlist Goku's help to try and take down Gast. Maybe they'll train, maybe Vegeta could teach Goku SSJ, and by the time the Androids come around, the two of them are enough to do something against the Androids. I wonder if Future Trunks appeared in this timeline at all.

So... XXI's definitely cooking something while Gast's cooking Janemba right 1 Replie(s)

I like this, I always thought it was impossible for Broly to destroy the entire universe with his MAXimum power alone, it's way too large and there's way too many stars

The longer that Broly stays in his LSSJ form, the more he shortens his life expectancy. Plus he's still a lifeform bound by needing to eat, sleep and drink. So if they can buy enough time, in their minds, Broly might just get tuckered out or have a stroke.

We know how this ends so that kinda ruins it, but at this point the Broly wank's been so seeped into DBM's story it's become the manga's core philosophy, and I'm excited to see just how much more they continue to overplay this Saiyan version of Hulk's power

Because magic doesn't equal strength, they're completely different. When you throw abilities like Janemba's into a battle, it turns the fight from a contest of strength into a chess match. Until you can find a counter to your opponent's ability(s), raw power doesn't mean much. Counter their abilities, and it turns back into a battle of strength, which is what people are talking about.

Goku was clearly overwhelming Janemba at the start of the fight when they both used raw strength, Goku's first kick even leaves a mark on his cheek. Janemba only gained the upper hand when he used his warp & portal magic. Heck Vegeta managed to counter his magic and got a few hits himself, but he was just SSJ2. Janemba's still stronger than Goku though, but they're pretty close.




That's kinda true, but since we don't see Janemba fight Gohan or Gotenks, they could 'retcon' the movie scaling to make Goku around Buu Saga Goku's level, and scale the other two above him like in the manga. The only case we see of Goku being stronger than Gohan & Gotenks is in Wrath of the Dragon, and I'm pretty sure DBM retconned the scaling there too so that Hirudegarn was stronger than Ultimate Gohan, and way ahead of SSJ3 Goku, who only won by exploiting the former's weakness. I'm saying "pretty sure" because we only see U16's version of the Wrath of the Dragon movie, and he scaled nicely with Vegito & Gohan there

It's way too early to tell though. Like DBZFan92 said, he's been constantly humiliated by magic, and it's clear that his temperament's getting worse. I and many others waaaay back theorised that XXI would end up controlling Vegito, but this is showing that he may just take advantage of Vegito's anger, not dissimilar to Babidi 1 Replie(s)

Honestly, really loved this chapter. Yeah it's not great that it didn't progress the story at all, but that feels like a 'it's not canon, so why bother?' way of looking at things. DBM ain't canon to DBZ/DBS, yet here we are.
This perfectly encapsulates what DBM's about, just a bunch of wacky what-if scenarios, and albiet with some... interesting scaling on Kakaditz's side, this chapter was just one awesome hit after another. It was an amazing fight, we got to see some world building for U13, seeing that Raditz genuinely cared for his brother. It also had some funny moments that I'm sure future new readers would laugh at.
This chapter only 'hurt' because for us, it took months to reach this conclusion, but retrospectively and for future newbies, this'd only take a few minutes to comb through, far better.

The ending, that too I think was expertly done. It was not only eluded to (I did't call it) earlier, but it makes sense that an exhausted SSJ3 Vegeta could beat a SSJ2 Kakarot, who doesn't fight properly, and Ultimate Raditz, originally the weakest of their team and not used to his new power, yet the former was still injured from their combined efforts nonetheless.
This was the best case scenario. If Vegeta no-diff'd them, it would've really made Ultimate Raditz feel worthless, but if Kakarot/Raditz won, any catharsis from the victory would've been robbed by it being a flashback. And regardless of who won or lost, if this was all real, we'd be complaining about plot inconsistencies and sad about some of the more interesting characters no longer being in the story. Glad they're still actually around! 1 Replie(s)

To be fair, if he went SSJ3 before he even turned up, he'd be unnecessarily burning through his time limit. Every second counts

I don't think it's fair to say Vegeta has a -% chance. Elder Kai said "This won't be sufficient to defeat your Vegeta. Especially with his new transformation", which makes me think he's somewhat below SSJ2 Prince Vegeta. If he was just below Vegeta's SSJ3, Kakaditz would've one-shot him.
Kakarot's around that level too, plus his immortality won't help much during this fight. If Vegeta blasts a whole through Kakarot's midsection, he'll be out of the fight long enough to maybe kill Raditz. He could win. Emphasis on 'could' though, cause it depends on how well Vegeta can bare the pain. If he can, I reckon he'd have about a minute of SSJ3 left (Against Raichi he'd already burnt through tons of Ki) and have a chance of winning, and if he can't then he'll plop over in pain without a fight.
Plus the Potaras didn't go through with them since they weren't apart of Universe 13, so Kakadiz ain't an option.

I don't think the power difference is that big, especially here. Remember, a very injured SSJ2 Prince Vegeta got blitzed by a SPC-levelled Cell Jr, and Piccolo said that 'fresh' it wouldn't be a guaranteed win. Imo Prince Vegeta's around a hypothetical SSJ3 Teen Gohan, and Kakarot & Raditz are around a hypothetical SSJ2 Goku (Or Vegeta) from the Cell Games, plus Vegeta's severely injured. He has a chance, but it certainly ain't overkill.

It's been shown multiple times that Vegeta's been abusive to the 3 of them: From leaving them injured without heals, insulting them, to straight up trying to kill them. From their dynamic, it also sounds like Vegeta uses Kakarot as a stress ball, beating him to a pulp whenever he steps out of line, or even to relieve some stress, and to show where he is in the pecking order. Sure he's their leader and got them to where they are, but they rule under Vegeta not just out of respect, but fear as well.
Vegeta wants to kill Kakarot but can't cause he's immortal, and Kakarot wants to kill Vegeta but can't since he's weaker. This is the chance they've been looking for, and while they're anything but good guys, they absolutely are the protagonists of this story. If the two brothers here win, it ain't fan service, just good writing, both narratively speaking and powerscaling-wise.


As for my own predictions on how things'll go: Vegeta plops over in defeat in the next panel. Kakarot and Raditz, the wind taken out of their sails look at each other in both confusion, and relief. They de-power, and Kakarot asks what they'll do now. Raditz'll say 'Let's just live happily, brother'. And the chapter will end with Kakarot agreeing, but looking maniacly over Vegeta, who's struggling to crawl away.

I really wanna root for Vegeta, his SSJ3 should last longer than most people're saying (Remembering against Raichi was his first time, plus he was injured, plus burnt up energy fighting in SSJ2 for a while)... But he did unleash that Final Flash a few pages ago, and those injuries are bad!
With all that, I doubt Getes can fight full throttle even if his SSJ3 lasts a few pages, he's weak enough that facing SSJ2 Kakarot and Ultimate Raditz at the same time could pose a problem, even if they're injured, I'm sure they can hold out long enough for Vegeta's SSJ3 to fizzle out. Heck, Kakarot should act as a shield since he's immortal, and Raditz should be tougher than base/SSJ1 Vegeta. They've got this!

Nappa, you just sit down and relax, you ain't got a place in this fight

Piccolo: "Even when he was just a baby and he tripped over that one time! Never, never I tell you!" Starts shaking Gohan

Also, I always loved that line, it really shows off how powerful Vegito is, but something always bugged me about it. We see him injured as far back as page 193 and he floats still so everyone can see him on pages 196-197. Wouldn't that have been a more appropriate time to say he's injured? Maybe the bruises weren't big enough to see 1 Replie(s)

I'm kinda digging this. It makes sense to me that Raditz isn't as strong as SSJ3 or even SSJ2 Prince Vegeta, given his power level and his lesser potential, of course comparing him to Gohan.
Raditz doesn't have much potential, mostly because he's not a hybrid, having Goku's potential at best. Idk why he ended up so weak in DBM considering the group he was apart of, but I'm guessing Raditz didn't train or fight as much as his comrades, focusing on his negotiation skills. At best he's as strong as Frieza's first form, and he can't transform.
Gohan came from Goku and Chi-Chi, was a human-Saiyan hybrid that was stated on many occasions to have amazing potential (So more than Raditz), and his power at the time of receiving the unlock would be in the several millions (In base), or stronger than SPC if we're counting SSJ2.


So, Gohan's base was many times stronger than Raditz's before their unlocks. Raditz's unlock put him a bit below SSJ2 Prince Vegeta's level (Just under SSJ2 Buu Saga Vegeta), and Gohan's put him well above SSJ3 Prince Vegeta. Assuming the Unlock gave them similar multipliers (Should give Raditz less), it checks out as Gohan's still many times stronger than Raditz.
In saying that, Raditz's progression is still really impressive. Remember he went from being lower than Frieza's first form to being close to SSJ2 Vegeta's overnight. And, that's not factoring in his Oozaru form! If he takes the earrings he'd probably fuse with Kakarot, most likely using deception or forcing it onto him. He'd be well above SSJ3 Prince Vegeta, and may even pose a threat to Vegito, plus he'd be immortal/half immortal on top of that.


This might be setting up something for later, he probably won't have fused with anyone when we get back to the present. 1 Replie(s)

We all know what's gonna happen. Either this is one long, extended gag and Raditz is only around Nappa's level, or it's serious and he can contend with his SSJ3 Vegeta & SSJ2 Oozaru Kakarot. I'm hoping for the latter, but I'd feel pretty sorry for Nappa, being a strong brute was like his only thing, and even that's about to be ripped away from him

So, my guess is that in order to try and save the universe, all the strongest fighters from Heaven & Hell will envoke the 'One day' rule, and join forces to bring down this almost invincible behemoth of a Saiyan? I really wanna be hyped, and I kinda am, I always love seeing what kinda shit the heroes can cobble together to try and take him down. But my hype gets soured since Broly's mostly invincible against everything. He's tanked attacks from well beyond SSJ3 level characters, even with his weaker variants.
My issue with the Rogeru manga was that they didn't take the chapter seriously, and Broly's ridiculous invincibility was dialed up to 1,000 as he tanked attacks that even his stronger future self would've been injured by (SSJ Vegito level).

Broly has so much potential as a character, especially if he takes inspiration from other characters like the Hulk. My hope's that this manga can inject him with just a little character, and not make him invincible against everything thrown at him. If that happens, this manga can shine as something truly great! If not... Well it's Broly so it'll still be pretty good 1 Replie(s)

They were mentioned in the prequel novel: Twin Pain. Gohan and Vegeta trained in the chamber for... I think a few months? But it ended up getting blown up by 17 cause he was angry at almost getting trapped in there. And they also made a remote that Krillin handled, but as Gohan and Vegeta were fighting 17 & 18, Krillin got hit and the remote was destroyed. They couldn't get close enough.

And I remember Cell, I also remember Gohan crying for a while after he died. He got back up and wanted to keep fighting, but at that point he was still stronger than Cell, so there was no doubt he could beat him and get revenge for what he did. However, after getting hit by one of Cell's blasts and the latter charging his Kamehameha, he was legit about to give up. He had to have a long pep talk from Goku in order to fight back, something that was robbed from this Gohan.
Plus again, Gohan wasn't fighting someone who was leagues stronger than him that'd beaten him up dozens of times. He still had the support of his friends, however little they could offer. AND, Gohan also had the dragon balls, so they could repair most of the damage Cell caused, and at least in Gohan's mind, they could still revive Goku (I think). Very different situations

I honestly love this interpretation of Gohan. People keep saying that Gohan shouldn't be like this or this isn't Gohan because he's faced the same kind of thing in the past several times yet back then he chose to save people, and now he's a depressed emo kid. But what Gohan's going through now is nothing like the situations he's been in in the past.
All of the previous times, Gohan wasn't the only one there who could face the threat, he had allies he could count on and he wasn't the sole 'hope' of the planet.
Against Vegeta? Krillin was there, and he just had to buy time until the Spirit Bomb was made.
Against Dodoria? He let his anger get the better of him, but still he hadn't seen how strong Dodoria was outside of killing weak Namekians, and Krillin was there.
Against the Ginyu Force? Not only were Vegeta and Krillin allies, but they knew Goku was coming to save them if he could just hold out a little longer.
Against Frieza? That's the most similar situation to this one, but Gohan knew if he could just buy a few seconds against Frieza, then he might get caught up in the planet's explosion, ending a universal threat once and for all (At least in his mind).

In most of these situations, he also had the comfort of the Dragon Balls to undo any damage, even making something like death relatively trivial. And, if there was a lingering threat that was stronger than them, they could either overcome them by training, or there'd be some new technique/Deus Machina that could save the day like the Time Chamber. There was always some hope he could cling onto, and that hope always came through.

Right now, Gohan's in a situation where he's not only seen his friends and family die, but they've died with no chance of getting revived by the Dragon Balls. They've also tried throwing everything at the Androids, but nothing worked. They tried using Senzu Beans and the Time Chamber, and Gohan even teamed up with Vegeta on top of that (Who was much stronger/more experienced than Gohan), and not only did none of that work, but Vegeta died. They also had a remote control that could shut the Androids down, but that broke in the battle.
So now Gohan's basically alone, up against 2 Androids that he can't even come close to beating one of. There's no Dragon Balls so death is permanent. The Time Chamber got destroyed, and the Senzus won't help much in a fight, they'll just keep him alive longer. Heck even regular training doesn't seem to do much.
This Gohan's had his hope crushed and spat on in front of his face more times than he can count, and that reality's been set into him for months/years. It's understandable he'd want to give up, there's no foreseeable way they can take out the Androids without say, years of training, and at that point (In Gohan's mind) the Androids would've killed everyone.

So, to try and address some of the 'issues' people've had with this manga in regards to Gohan's personality.
Gohan being an edgy emo: This Gohan's been weathered by years of constant disappointment and his hope being crushed, over and over again, but this time death is permanent so the stakes are higher.
Gohan wanting to unalive himself: Beyond being weathered by years of hope crushing, this Gohan JUST had a new hope introduced in talking to his dad, that was also crushed as quickly as it came. This feeling of disappointment is fresh, he's upset, so he's going to be more bitter than usual, it's not like Gohan will always be like this. He hasn't been given any time to recoup, plus he's just seen that his friends are all partying it up in the Afterlife. So as grim as the reality is, he can either live in the hell that Earth is with 2 unstoppable killing machines, or he can be at peace with his friends and family.
Gohan not saving Roshi: And what, put Bulma and Trunks at risk as well as getting pummeled again? If history was anything to go by, he wouldn't be able to save Roshi, he may die, and Bulma/Trunks would also die. This was the smarter option.

All in all I'm loving this chapter, the story's realistic and great, and the art's pretty good too. I'm actually hoping for a part 2, keep up the great work guys! 2 Replie(s)

He's a 12-13 year old kid who hates fighting, who's seen millions of people die before him in a world where death is permanent, including his own friends/family/mentors and people who're much stronger than him. He's fought the Androids many times to no success, and he hasn't even gotten stronger from training.
What's worse, he's now seen that his dead friends are having the time of their life in Otherworld.

While this Gohan is kinda hard to watch, this is a wonderfully written Gohan who's more realistic than any of the characters seen in the series thus far

I could be wrong, but wasn't the first chapter or so of Twin Pain at the end of the story? Then afterwards it goes to the beginning. So the rest of the chapter could maybe tell us how this all unfolds 1 Replie(s)

"I feel like I'm confident that your power is not superior to that of Ultra Instinct" Tell that to half the DB fandom, you'll get shot straight out of the sky

God this brings back memories. Buu's just trying his best!

Yamcha's really playing the true pacifist route right now in DBM. Ya know what, I can respect that, but stranding XXI in that universe isn't gonna do anything. The Vargas probably have ships or other tech popping in from other universes occasionally to make sure everything's alright, and even though non-Vargas can't use the multiversal technology, what if XXI could space-time rewind the broken machinery, and then brainwash the Vargas to have them send him to other universes?

Oh my god, my boy Yamcha's about to pull a W and no one's gonna be able to see it 1 Replie(s)

Yes...! If this includes extra pages like the last chapter, I've been waiting for this for a very long time. Can't wait to see the universes eat the chef out of home

Why does it look like Vegito's body was twisted around? Look at him in the last panel, doesn't it look like his butt's facing forward?

Rest in peace, Akira Toriyama. You'll always be remembered as one of the best mangaka that ever lived, and your many series will be enjoyed for decades to come!

Definitely 17, he's probably happy to see another murder happy android

I'm thinking somewhere between Imperfect Cell and Semi-Perfect Cell. Remember Semi-Perfect Cell took out half of 16's head with a single Ki Blast, and Super Vegeta's stronger than him.
So maybe I'K'L is as strong as SSJ Trunks after RoSaT training? I'm just now realising that no one's been between Cell's first and second form's power. You were either weaker than his Imperfect form, or stronger than his Semi-Perfect form. No in-between. Maybe with the one exception of Piccolo during the Cell Games, but who knows.

Assuming this isn't a Ki Construct, it's nothing a bit of super glue and flex tape can't fix :)

I doubt I'K'L is all that bad, after all it didn't kill the Namekian or Vargas in the waiting room.
Honestly, I was banking that I'K'L was gonna open up a portal and free Uub

Dude, if Gohan and Goku spar in the next 2 pages, it'll coincide exactly with them sparring in the actual DBS manga! This is incredible

Not that I wanna debate if Goku would leave his family for that long stretch of time - He would, but has it really been 3 years? I know the DBZ Wiki's timeline says it's been 3 years but I'm having trouble crunching the numbers, even from the Moro arc. Hang on.

A few months pass after Moro's defeat, Granola retrieves 7-3. Another month or so passed for the Heaters to retrieve Goku/Vegeta, and another month to get to planet Cereal (Rounding up, accounting for missed days).
I think the following High School Arc takes place shortly after Goku/Vegeta beat Gas, and it takes place over a few weeks. Hedo gets arrested, 3 months pass and he's released, then 6 months pass and Super Hero takes place.

Maybe I'm being picky or my math's wrong, but wouldn't Super Hero, and thus this story be like 1.5-2 years after beating Moro (Last time Goku saw Gohan)? 1 Replie(s)

I heard that if the big bad kills off their henchmen, they don't come off as threatening, just incompetent. He deserved what he got in all the universes 1 Replie(s)

Damn, didn't even give him til the count of 5. Poor ice caps.
I've actually really enjoyed this special, it's always nice to see a new Frost Demon and even if Bojack's one of the more 'boring' villains, his backstory's barely been elaborated on, and it's cool seeing how he ties in with the other DBZ villains. I imagine Bojack had a rush of Dejavu when he saw Cold transform

This will definitely pave the way for new nightmare fuel, and I for one am eager to see it

My highest respect goes out to the people who wrote and drew this, and to Goku and Vegeta for fighting so valiantly. I haven't seen a fight this good since Naruto Vs Sasuke (Last one).
Both their bodies were broken, yet they kept struggling until their minds gave out. In the end, I'm sure Vegeta was even more satisfied with the outcome than Goku was

This is it right? The duel exchange to end of duel exchanges, one of them's gotta fall after this.

I'm gonna make a wild prediction. Both of them fall to the ground, maybe after another exchange, and stay down for a few pages with people worrying about them. Finally, Vegeta stands up, his body broken but still working unlike Goku, and the comment section's gonna be filled with people quoting "Victory for Vegeta" over and over

There's no way in the Multiverse that big ears over here's gonna be the new commander of the Pride Troopers. I'm thinking either Kahseral since he's already the group's pilot, plus he just looks like a commander, or Dyspo since he seems like the natural #3 in the group next to Toppo and Ear Hole. 1 Replie(s)

First off, lemmie just say that the art for this entire fight is absolute molten fire! I don't even care who wins, I'm just glad we got to see such a spectacle.

And secondly regarding the new DB series, I'm 100% hyped for it, I think it's exactly what Dragon Ball needed right about now. DBGT was already great, but this looks like it could be Akira's masterpiece! I'm really excited to see Dragon Ball return to an adventure format, I've found things have been getting a tad stale since Dragon Ball's mostly been fighting up until recently.

Also yeah sorry mods, won't say another word on the topic

So... Are they gonna start training now? I guess teaching Krillin about the prison life could be considered training

I've seen a few videos going around recently talking about Gokhan, one youtube short that was released less than a week ago in particular.
Plus what Comic-P said.

I've been seeing a lot of Gokhan stuff around, so it'd be nice to see that happen. They could fuse, Buutenks is shocked, Gokhan goes SSJ/Mystic, steamrolls Buutenks, the fusion wears off, maybe Gokhan lets himself get absorbed, defuse, save Goten Trunks and Pickleman, escapes, and then they'd team up to crush Super Buu, or Kid Buu if they saved Mr Buu. If Vegeta gets revived then he'd be very proud of our boy in orange!

Idk, just a possible scenario of what could happen, who knows how this'll play out, but I'm VERY excited to see

Looks like Krillin really put his head through the Shine-o ball-o for this voyage. I personally love the U3/9 stories, I just wish they were a bit less messy, they're kinda all over the place with the order we've seen them in. Can't wait to see how Krillfish handles Roshi's training by himself without Goku though

I'm thinking this is the Saiyan Beyond God form. While training with Whis, the Angel tells them that their hightened energy's leaking out of them, and that they need to keep it within their body to maximise their power with little to no drawbacks.

Also, since this got brought up, I've noticed DBS has stolen/taken inspiration from a few of DBM's ideas. You've got the whole idea about a Multiverse (Both in Super and Heroes, though everyone's doing that nowadays), Ghast inspiring the two Namekian warriors from U6 who absorbed their whole race, and Bra inspiring Kefla. There's more but I've forgotten, and will drop the subject.

Anyways, I do apologise about saying this fight was pointless, both Goku and Vegeta having new forms was the perfect way to make it less predictable and more entertaining. And while I don't care for multipliers as I think they make transformations a simple numbers game, I can venture to guess this isn't too much stronger than SSJ3. In the first place, I feel like 20 years of training should've made their SSJ3 forms stronger than Mystic Gohan, but they're likely stronger than him now. But, Remember in Bardock's vision, Bra tells them that they're no match for Vegito, likely even with her help. 1 Replie(s)

As someone who lacks creativity when it comes to Dragon Ball, I personally hope this 'new form' is either:
Full Power SSJ3. It's just SSJ3 but slightly flashier.
Or SSJ3 Kaioken. Assuming Getes doesn't have anything else new, Goku could beat him with either of these new forms. 1 Replie(s)

I'm honestly not sure how to feel about this fight. It's going to be amazing, and drawn super well, no doubt about it. But idk, it's hard to get excited for this fight knowing that Goku and Vegeta could just do this back in their own universe. We've seen both of them fight with the whole Earth on the line twice before (Plus an extra time in chapter 78) and there's no real stakes with this, no more than there could be back home at least. Need a ring? They're friends with the announcer of the World Martial Arts tournament, and have a budget of a few hundred million Zenni via Bulma. Need an audience? How about the population of Earth, they could use some nice entertainment after 20 years of peace.

On top of that, I can't see either of them showing off anything new. Goku's already been pushed to the fainting point by Uub so I doubt he has anything else to show, and Vegeta's already shown his 2 trump cards. Hopefully I'll be proven wrong, but I still would've rather watched Uub vs Vegeta, that'd be a really cool fight since Uub's been training and learning new techniques. 1 Replie(s)

H-h-help me, I'm g-glitching! Goodbye DBM!

We're getting this because we aren't getting a proper fight, aren't we?

Fully agree, although, I think there's another protagonist in DBM lurking amongst their midst. Uub.
Both Bra and Uub are basically DBM OCs, they've had tons of progression throughout the series, and they've both been set up as the heroes of this manga (Albeit in different ways).

Also, I'm seeing a lot of people saying that Gast should win because he has magic, and that'd be a perfect match for XXI who also uses magic. I can see that logic for sure, but honestly, if Bra's able to beat Gast, especially if he ends up using magic, then I feel like that'd prove she can counter magic, and would be a more suitable opponent for XXI. Plus, her winning against a magician when Vegito lost would add another nail to the coffin.
Also also, this is very out there but if Bra beats Gast, I could see either he or Uub trying to teach Bra some magic to have as another arsenal against XXI

I'm definitely betting Bra will win. Guess I was half wrong about Gast's 'power shut down' magic, I thought he wouldn't be able to move if he used it. Heck at least he's considering it a 'petty trick', so that's something.

Still, I wonder if Gast's wish would even be possible, and if it isn't, if he realises that.
Gast's wish is to resurrect the Namekian race back in his universe, but is that even possible? I'm sure Porunga couldn't resurrect the Namekians who fused to make Gast as they're technically not dead (Like how Buu couldn't revive/create Gohan), and I highly doubt he couldn't split Gast into the Namekians he was fused from (Like Vegito).
There are some Namekians who died from Frieza that never fused with Nail, so maybe it's possible to revive them? It'd still be a tough order, since they died over 30 years ago.

If the above was all correct and Gast realised it, he'd throw the fight, or at least make sure Bra could win by only using brute force. 1 Replie(s)