So many people saying 'no consequences', when Bra has to live her entire life with Vegetto, Gohan, Pan, everyone, knowing she killed her brother, Piccolo, and thousands of innocents. But sure. She only gets rewarded for this.

The lot of you think the only punishment fitting is a permanent death, so you can satisfy your desire to see a 16-year old girl die. 6 Replie(s)

Going to reply to you in pieces like you did me, but I want to say this:

My main point here is that I'm immensely frustrated with DBM fans for calling Bra: 1. A poorly written character (Mary Sue or otherwise), 2. A monster, and 3. Being incredibly frustrated with her for a myriad of reasons (spoiled brat, killed people, is rude, whatever), without ever taking the time to bitch about everyone else in this series who are worse. Where's the hate for Goku's terrible parenting? Or his willingness to endanger the population of Earth so he can have a good fight? Where is the outrage about Vegeta as a whole, the genocidal psychopath who murdered a village of Namekians because he could? Who beat the shit out of children multiple times because it suited his mood? It's annoying.

Bra IS a spoiled brat. She is immensely smug and full of herself. She's arrogant to a fault. She's also scared, desperately wants her father's approval, and is under the impression that her father both wants her to get stronger but also is willing to kill her before she can manage it. She's young, a 16-year old teenager, and she's about as big of a brat as most people are at her age.

The problem? She's the second strongest being in existence, and she has a lot of trouble controlling that power. She did not ask for that power, and she is not trained well enough to handle it. The Z-fighters are as much at fault for that as she is.

And let's not forget: Power corrupts. Give someone the power to casually end solar systems, and they will be corrupted by that power. This all means Bra is a dangerous, spoiled, teenage brat who has a lot of growing up to do, and that she is a well-written character.



You're splitting hairs at this point. She's a child. It's a distinction without a difference.



Yes, because most people on here hate on Bra without ever giving the same criticism to the rest of the cast.



That scene takes an ever darker tone when you realize that Bra takes this an implicit threat of her death if she fails to control herself. Her memory of Vegetto's threat is not a plea from Vegetto to help him help her. It was "You are becoming stronger than me. Before that happens, I'll kill you.".



Abuse isn't just limited to physical trauma. Vegetto is NOT someone who handles frustration well. He is everything good, and everything bad, about Goku and Vegeta. Both of them were pretty shitty fathers overall, Goku to the point where it's a meme within the community. He loves her, yes, but he sets an expectation for her to eventually give him a good fight. Have you read the novelization? The Kaoshins fear Vegetto will eventually lose it because the frustration of needing to be challenged gnaws at him. He *wants* Bra to become stronger than him, so that he can fight her. He wants a good fight, but he also wants someone who can stop him if he loses it.

Vegetto is a parent of neglect, similar to how Goku and Vegeta were. She desperately wants her father's approval, but she never seems to manage it. It's not excusing her behavior. See above. I'm saying she has reasons for her trauma and her mental issues.



You're right. Gohan went through a lot worse, and somehow became a well functioning adult. We can chalk that up to Chi Chi somehow, or we can stop pretending. Gohan is not a well-written character. He SHOULD be a mess emotionally with heavy PTSD. He should be jaded and scared of his life being ripped apart again and again. That's how normal people react. Toriyama did not do that, because he didn't care to make Gohan realistic.




She didn't go psycho. That's straight up ignoring the fact that a dark sorcerer used mind control magic on her to bring out all of the negative attributes of her character. The same magic enslaved the king of the underworld and had him abandon his kingdom. The ONLY person we see in canon resist Babidi's mind magic is Vegeta, and in DBM canon, Cell.

As for when she went SSJ2? Your wonder boy Gohan almost let the entire Earth die when he first went SSJ2 and got his father killed in the process. Incidentally, DBM canon also tells us that huge amount of power in an untrained mind cause mental and physical instability, see Broly and Cold. Ginyu was unaffected by both Cold's power and Bra's power, and it's made clear he's able to do that because of his intense mental conditioning to control other people's powers.


Turns out when you have absolute power, it corrupts you. Who'd have thought?



Again, splitting hairs. In that same chapter, Vegetto gets actually excited when her power eclipses Broly as a child. You're ignoring my point here that Vegetto's first thoughts for his newborn daughter was that she would be way stronger and he was excited about that prospect.



Obviously they didn't teach her to control her power. She couldn't go SSJ2 at the beginning of the manga without going berserk, and yet the Z-fighters thought it perfectly fine to bring her to a tournament with people that can mind control people. Great mentors!


She doesn't even remember! She doesn't really understand what's going. She wakes up, her dad's there, everything hurts, and she finds out she surpassed Gohan. She's 12 at the time. She doesn't understand what just happened.

Also, we already know from Gohan that even people who dislike violence become sadists when they first transform into SSJ2.


Dear lord, man. I don't get how you casually say a 12-year old isn't a child. I can't argue with ignoring basic definitions.



She just woke up and immediately said she doesn't remember what happened. I also never said it wasn't her fault. She IS to blame for her actions, and the rest of her family shares in that responsibility for sending a 12-year who's unable to control herself while in SSJ to fight against people who thought they were strong enough to fight Vegetto. The Kaoshins are also partially to blame. I'm sorry you didn't think 12 year olds are children.



Okay. He literally says "Oh, she'll become way stronger!" with an excited grin on his face.



Also, it's both sad and hilarious that somehow a 6-yr old can abuse a 50+ yr-old saiyan and her father to boot because she's being a bratty 6-yr old. This is such a ridiculous comment.



Yeah, the DBM community bothers me greatly with some of their views on this stuff. Sit here and defend monsters like Vegeta, absentee parents like Goku, kidnappers like Piccolo, and then get infuriated that Bra is a bratty teenager? Sure. It's very clear a lot of people on here don't care about Bra's actions. If they did, they'd be calling down Vegeta, Goku, and Piccolo just as often, and they'd be up in arms blaming Gohan for getting Goku killed for letting SSJ2 go to his head.

Bra's essentially Vegeta with her attitude and personality with Bulma's sarcastic side, but people dislike her because she isn't Vegeta. She's a girl, and that always gets people more upset for no reason. It's beyond frustrating. 4 Replie(s)

Do you hear yourself? "I don't view him as abusive, even now. He very clearly loves his daughter. He doesn't actually kill her after she destroys the Solar System". Apparently someone only becomes abusive when they kill their own kid?! Seriously now?

Vegetto is NOT stable. If you read the novelization, the Kaoshins are JUST as worried about Vegetto as they are about Bra. In fact, they were kind of happy that Bra was around as someone who might be able to STOP Vegetto.

And hell, just look at the manga: https://w...742.html#h_read. He wanted to break Gohan's skull for losing the tournament! He even has to tell himself 'see I can control myself'.

And of course Babidi is to blame. He's a monster. But the people on this site paint Bra as this absolute monstrosity when in reality she's a troubled, bitchy teenage girl with the power to casually end solar systems. She also has the curse where she loses her mind when she uses that power, but her father WANTS her to be as strong as possible.

>Bra's issue (when she is in control of herself like now) is that she usually lacks empathy or remorse. She was very condescending when she offered her wish to U19, she didn't seem to comprehend the seriousness of her actions in the prior special, etc.

If this is the baseline it's ridiculous. She 'seemed' condescending when offering a universe a wish? Really? How about after she killed the woman in her first fight? Did you not see her face full of negative emotion?

https://w...368.html#h_read

Look at her face after the punch. Full of pain, guilt, anger. Her best friend died in front of her. This is a NORMAL response to want to kill that woman, because she watched Pan die in front of her. Come on! She's 16! All of us were emotional rollercoasters. That didn't make us evil, and we acted like brats just like her except we didn't have to bear the burden of out of control power that casually ends star systems.



How about Bulma refusing to talk to him for almost killing her, killing thousands of people, and letting himself be controlled? How about Trunks losing respect for his father and no longer seeing him as this great man, and yelling in his face for being so weak?

Vegeta doesn't care about going to hell. It never bothered him. His son calling him weak and no longer looking up to him? That'd be a punishment for Vegeta.

He did get off easy. 'Going to hell' is just words. It didn't actually affect Vegeta's mind. He never even mentions it.
2 Replie(s)

Yeah, because that had a lasting impact on Vegeta's state of mind and behavior. Also, none of the people he actually cared about ever brought it up to him again after that. He got off easy. He almost killed Bulma with his blast. 1 Replie(s)

Oh are you for real right now? Please name anything besides 1. Her first transformation into SSJ2 (the same transformation that had Gohan toy with Cell and almost get them all killed/got Goku killed) and 2. Her going Majin just now. Name one instance in which she's evil or going down 'the path of Vegeta'. Come on.



News to me that 12 year olds aren't children. By the way, do you blame Gohan for fucking around and almost getting the Earth destroyed and getting Goku killed when he first turned SSJ2? I seem to remember Gohan letting Cell throw a Kamehameha at the planet and only blasting it away at the last possible moment as well, risking the Earth. Seems pretty fucking similar except Gohan had teachers who took the time to help him control his rage.

What abuse? I find it really funny how you ignore the main instances of abuse, or, at the very least, shitty parenting. When normal kids have shitty parents, they rebel by drinking on the weekends. When the second strongest being in the universe has a shitty planet, turns out she has some problems. Here's some instances of Bra's trauma:

https://w...233.html#h_read
https://w...234.html#h_read

And hey! How about that! Turns out Bra just needed someone to keep her calm, be patient with her, and help her control her emotions!

https://w...237.html#h_read

Gohan managed it in a few hours. Wonder why Vegetto couldn't manage it?

How do you think a normal child handles feeling weak? Because Bra's been frustrated by her dad and brother's power since she was a little girl:

https://w...227.html#h_read

It's not surprising she's developed this complex. Her father's first comments about her after she was born was about how strong she'd be. His first prideful moment was that her power eclipsed Broly's as a child:

https://w...294.html#h_read
https://w...295.html#h_read

And how does Vegetto handle his daughter when she does what he wanted and becomes too strong too quickly? After he fails to help teach her how to control her power:

https://www.dragonball-multiverse.com/en/page-1795.html

He threatens to kill her. But NOT ONLY THAT, we KNOW how Bra remembers this exact same scene:

https://w...743.html#h_read

For Vegetto, it was a plea to her to control herself so he doesn't have to do that. But guess what? She's a child. All she remembers through the years is that her dad threatened to kill her before she became more powerful than him. And yet, we know that Vegetto's first thought about his daughter's future was that she'd grow way stronger!

It's so obvious it's ridiculous.
2 Replie(s)

Please, please show me where Vegeta was ever really given shit for going Majin in the Buu saga. He was scolded by Goku and Piccolo while he was Majin but otherwise, it's never brought up again.

Also, Bra IS fucked up. I'm annoyed by the amount of people here who hate her so fiercely and talk about it every single page. She's not a bad character.




And Bra was raised as the second most powerful being in existence by an abusive father who only barely hid his desire to have a strong opponent. When she was young in the time chamber, he couldn't stand to deal with her for even a few hours and literally gave up on training her, leaving it to Gohan to handle it. Bra is a perfectly reasonable character who just so happens to have the power to blink out stars. It's ridiculous how often people on here act as if she's this stupidly evil bitch when in reality she's a punk teenager.



1. Please, show me where in the story Vegeta has to face the consequences from his loved ones about going Majin. Goku and Piccolo scold him while he's Majin, but once he's brought back to life, it's entirely forgotten.

2. Bra's father is an abusive parent who does not understand how to teach someone to live with the massive responsibility of being the second most powerful being in existence. For all the shit people on here give Bra, she hasn't DONE anything bad before this tournament, really. And besides being a bratty teenager, she hasn't done anything evil until being majinized. Y'all act as if she's incredibly evil when she's just a normal teenage girl. None of us were any better at her age, and we didn't have the excuse that we have enough power to do anything we want by the time we were 12. 1 Replie(s)

Watch as this thread turns into "Mary Sue! Obvious favorite! No sympathy! Let her die!" and then people pretending ignoring that they're favorite Vegeta did much worse than Bra in his life and none of them want him dead. Hmmm, I wonder what the main difference between Vegeta and Bra is? Why would people excuse Vegeta but not Bra, the 16-year old teenage girl? 6 Replie(s)

In this comment chain: People pretending that Vegetto didn't actively want to kill Gohan when Gohan told him he lost.

https://w...742.html#h_read

But yes, let's pretend that Vegetto is acting out of character here.

Yeah, let's just casually forget that Vegito specifically had to remove himself from the situation because he wanted to murder his own son for telling him he lost. Let's forget about the written narrative account of Vegito consistently almost losing it and actively considering hurting Gohan's loved ones to bring out more of Gohan's power.

You just hate Bra, and you want any justification that says you're right for hating a girl who did not ask for her power nor did she ask for a father who emotionally abuses her for her entire life. Bra ain't a good person, but the amount of hate she gets here is ridiculous. I don't see you hating on the other players in the cast in the same way even though their actions are worse.

It's absolutely ridiculous how so many commenters here hate on Bra for every reason under the hood, and yet most of you would say you love Vegeta as a character immensely. They're the same personality type, but Vegeta actively enjoyed killing people for decades. The fact that none of you are screaming for Vegeta to pay for the thousands/millions of people he's killed shows you don't actually care about Bra's sins. You just want to feel justified in hating her. 4 Replie(s)